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Posts From the Internet Film Discussion Group, a_film_by
This group is dedicated to discussing film as art
from an auteurist perspective. The index to these files of posts can be found at http://www.fredcamper.com/afilmby/ The purpose of these files is to make our posts more accessible, for downloading and reading and to search engines.
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emailing them from that Web site.
8501
From: hotlove666
Date: Mon Mar 22, 2004 10:44pm
Subject: Re: Sirk Spectacular
>
> I wept BUCKETS when I saw this film in its original
> release, and I was scarcely alone. If you can make it
> dry-eyed through the last reel I would be very surprised.
>
>That funeral....
With Gavin and Kohner to q and a? Just try and keep me away!
8502
From: Doug Cummings
Date: Mon Mar 22, 2004 11:05pm
Subject: Macao
>Oh wow! on April 7 the American Cinemathque at the
>Egyptian Theatre is going to show Imitation of
>Life
The Cinematheque is also showing Sternberg's "Macao" in April as part
of its noir fest, which was apparently partly ghost directed by
Nicholas Ray. I haven't seen it yet--recommended?
Doug
8503
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 0:01am
Subject: Re: Macao
-
> The Cinematheque is also showing Sternberg's "Macao" in
April as part
> of its noir fest, which was apparently partly ghost directed by
> Nicholas Ray. I haven't seen it yet--recommended?
Not great Sternberg. Not great Ray. Fun noir. Looks great.
8504
From: Michael Worrall
Date: Mon Mar 22, 2004 11:55pm
Subject: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..
My friend Jack Angstreich is sending me the posts on HK filmmakers, so
I just could not resist started up again. I was very impressed with
Chan's first "Police Story" film, in particular the open sequence in
the shanty town. The editing, the clear placement of action, the jaw
dropping scene of Chan driving his car through the town and the great
homage to Keaton as Chan runs down the hill to catch the escaping
crime boss is first rate filmmaking to me. "Mr Canton and Lady Rose"
is a labor of love- and it is a bit labored in its self-consciousness-
but it shows a love of filmmaking that is pretty much absent in
today's commercial filmmaking.
I haven't seen Stanley Tong (who directed Chan in Police Story III and
IV) mentioned in the posts, and out all of the HK directors I think he
has the most sure hand in creating solid, clean and coherent action
films. Maybe more conventional, but seeminglessly put together.
David Bordwell writes at length on Kirk Wong in his book "Planet Hong
Kong" which I very much reccommend. Stephen Teo thinks Wong has a
hamfisted style and has the grace of a bull in a china shop. Bordwell
also devotes a whole chapter to Wong Jing, a director I have major
problems with, but I must admit that I found "God of Gamblers" to be
extraordinary. Last weekend I watched Sammo Hung's "The Moon
Warriors" and while I could do without the "Free Willy" sub-plot, it
was a delighful film, a very well made action/maitinee film. Tsui
Hark, to me, reaches the genius of E
8505
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 0:17am
Subject: Re: Macao
It's of interest, but marginally. A few shots that are
obviously Sternberg. Others look pretty much Ray --
without his heart in it.
The stars twinkle, however.
--- Doug Cummings wrote:
> >Oh wow! on April 7 the American Cinemathque at the
> >Egyptian Theatre is going to show Imitation of
> >Life
>
> The Cinematheque is also showing Sternberg's "Macao"
> in April as part
> of its noir fest, which was apparently partly ghost
> directed by
> Nicholas Ray. I haven't seen it yet--recommended?
>
> Doug
>
>
>
__________________________________
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8506
From:
Date: Mon Mar 22, 2004 7:34pm
Subject: Re: Macao
"Macao" seems genuinely Sternberg-like in most of its visual style. Much of
the film is fascinating to look at. I have only seen it on TV, but always enjoy
it. It is not "Shanghai Gesture", but it is a film I would never miss.
Mike Grost
PS: There are notes on Macao in my Sternberg article at:
http://members.aol.com/MG4273/sternb.htm
8507
From: Jess Amortell
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 0:57am
Subject: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein wrote:
> No wonder Sirk retired after
> making it. He'd said it all.
Even though he wasn't a "REAL" auteur?
> Ther are a number of absolute 24/7 auteurs: Fellini,
> Hitchcock, Godard, Bresson, Rivette, Chereau, Rohmer,
> Mankiewicz, Resnais, Pasolini, Jarman, Sturges,
> Dreyer, Demy, DeMille,Warhol.
>
> Then there a lot of really, really talented directors:
> Cukor, Hawks, Curtiz, Walters,Morrissey, Minnelli.
8508
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:18am
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..
>
> I haven't seen Stanley Tong (who directed Chan in Police Story
III and
> IV) mentioned in the posts, and out all of the HK directors I
think he
> has the most sure hand in creating solid, clean and coherent
action
> films. Maybe more conventional, but seeminglessly put
together.
Does this include Rumble in the Bronx????
8509
From: Fred Camper
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:50am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
Of core this film is a masterpiece. Much of what's so great about the
end is the way the DIRECTOR'S style (tweaking David a little bit, no
need to reply, he has the right to think that Lana Turner is really the
auteur if he wants too -- why didn't you even tell how the movie's story
resembles her life, David?) produces a kind of triumph of surfaces.
Sarah Jane tries to peel them back by clutching at the flowers, but
cannot -- she only gets more flowers.
I went to a Sirk conference at Dartmouth in 1997. They hadn't invited
me, but when I heard about it I asked if I could attend, and they
offered to pay my transpiration if I gave a talk, which I think was a
less good deal than the other people got, but I took it. I didn't want
to let those academics do a Sirk conference on their own! There were
many papers. I won't try to judge my own, but of all the papers only two
others seemed to express any enthusiasm for the films at all. There were
scholarly studies of Zarah Leander and so on, not that I don't think
people should do that. One of the two worst was a paper by Eric
Rentschler. (Uh-oh, I may have posted about this before?) It was
potentially of at least some interest to me: his subject was the
reception of Sirk's American films in Germany. As far as I could tell
all he did is organize reviews in order of increasing negativity, and I
think it was clear that his agenda was to express a hatred of Sirk's
American films. He later said that there was no visible difference
between the styles of Sirk, Ray and Minnelli. To me this simply showed
that he had no eye for these directors work at all, or for film style in
general, though maybe his style-meter got fried watching too many Nazi
films for his book. But to me this claim would be a like a musicologist
saying that he couldn't tell the difference between Bach, Handel, and
Couperin. I guess in the Camper Academy of Cinema Art (aka CACA, an
acronym already in use by another group I'm part of, which I'm ready to
form as soon as someone donates, say, $200 million, since we'd need to
start by restoring a lot of films and buying a lot of prints, and no
videos of films either) you wouldn't be allowed to graduate unless you
could tell in some sort of blind test which director made key scenes
from the films of all three -- hard to do in practice unless you could
keep the students in isolation and make sure they never saw the films
you would use in the test.
The other of the two worst was a "paper" by the chairman of Datrmouth's
English Department, who was African American, and whose name escapes me.
He waved a videocassette over his head while announcing that no
African-American could possibly like this film. I told Tag about that
and he told me about how he saw it when it opened in Philadelphia with
theaters full of crying African Americans. Anyway, he then proceeded to
claim it was one of two Stahl remakes by Sirk (wrong, it's one of
three). He claimed the beach was Atlantic City (wrong, Coney Island, as
should be obvious to anyone who knows New York). Worst of all, he
claimed that Laura Meredith (Turner) was "the object of the
photographer's gaze" (gosh, what an original phrase to hear at an
academic film conference) in that the photo that he took of her on the
beach is what launched her acting career. Wrong. As anyone who knows the
film well knows, it was "that certain je ne sais quoi that you got with
the dog" in an advertising photo not taken by the Gavin character
(quoted from memory, perhaps with a wrong word or two). Lucy Fisher
wrote an article on the film in the book she edited on it in which she
stresses Laura Meredith as an example of a strong, independent woman;
I'm not a big fan of stressing issues such as that one in analyzing
films, but Fisher seemed like a genius compared to this guy's willful
misreading. What's the point of having a videotape in your hand if you
can't use it to check the plot?
All this left me more depressed than I'd expected, and at the end of the
conference I had a sudden and massive infection in my leg and the
hospital I went to right from the closing lunch told me it was
life-threatening and they insisted on admitting me. So the conference
cost me about $6,000 more than I'd expected it to, because I was there
for six days on IV antibiotics. I guess it's true about depression
lowering your immune response.
- Fred C. (who is still planning a response to the now-old-autuerism thread)
8510
From: Hadrian
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:59am
Subject: Re: Rosenbaum gives author auteur status
It seems a particularly shaky case for auteur status, at most it
proves that stars can be powerful forces that effect the film; but
so can the weather. A good director will either be able to handle
and shape that into a cohesive whole (form and meaning, as Rosenbaum
put it), or not. Monroe certainly wasn't going to do it.
8511
From: Hadrian
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:00am
Subject: Re: Rosenbaum gives author auteur status
It seems a particularly shaky case for auteur status, at most it
proves that stars can be powerful forces that effect the film; but
so can the weather. A good director will either be able to handle
and shape that into a cohesive whole (form and meaning, as Rosenbaum
put it), or not. Monroe certainly wasn't going to do it.
8512
From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:52am
Subject: Re: Macao
> The Cinematheque is also showing Sternberg's "Macao" in April as part
> of its noir fest, which was apparently partly ghost directed by
> Nicholas Ray. I haven't seen it yet--recommended?
Heck yeah! It's pretty confused and maybe not a "good movie," but
it's a lot of fun and a bonus for auteurist scavenger hunts. It's a
pretty even Sternberg/Ray mix: the backgrounds and designs and
Oriental fetishes are all JVS, but it otherwise "feels" and sounds
like a Ray.
-Jaime
8513
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:55am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- Fred Camper wrote:
>
> The other of the two worst was a "paper" by the
> chairman of Datrmouth's
> English Department, who was African American, and
> whose name escapes me.
> He waved a videocassette over his head while
> announcing that no
> African-American could possibly like this film.
>
>
Hmm. Well I guess I'm not black, hunh?
Jesus H. Mel-Gibson-on-the-Cross am I sick of this
crap! I spent the better part of this weekend ripping
Jesse Jackson a new one (im a piece I'm doing for "The
Advocate") for claiming that the gay rights and civil
rights movement having nothing whatsoever in common.
He seems to forget that without a gay black man named
Bayard Rustin he wouldn't have a platform to speak on
today.
Too bad for him that I have such a good memory -- and
that I'm such a bitch on top of it!
But I digress. I had the great pleasure of meeting
Juanita Moore recently. She's a lovely and remarkable
woman.
>
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8514
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:56am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- Jess Amortell wrote:
>
> Even though he wasn't a "REAL" auteur?
>
>
>
> > Ther are a number of absolute 24/7 auteurs:
> Fellini,
> > Hitchcock, Godard, Bresson, Rivette, Chereau,
> Rohmer,
> > Mankiewicz, Resnais, Pasolini, Jarman, Sturges,
> > Dreyer, Demy, DeMille,Warhol.
> >
> > Then there a lot of really, really talented
> directors:
> > Cukor, Hawks, Curtiz, Walters,Morrissey, Minnelli.
>
>
No he was an auteur alright. That was a partial list.
__________________________________
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Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
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8515
From: Fred Camper
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:23am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
David Ehrenstein wrote:
>
>
>Hmm. Well I guess I'm not black, hunh?
>
>Jesus H. Mel-Gibson-on-the-Cross am I sick of this
>crap!....
>
Thanks, David. I was hoping to hear you say something like that. In
return, I promise to look the other way the next time you declare Bette
Davis an auteur.
- Fred C.
8516
From: jpcoursodon
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:30am
Subject: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Fred Camper wrote:
and I
> All this left me more depressed than I'd expected, and at the end
of the
> conference I had a sudden and massive infection in my leg and the
> hospital I went to right from the closing lunch told me it was
> life-threatening and they insisted on admitting me. So the
conference
> cost me about $6,000 more than I'd expected it to, because I was
there
> for six days on IV antibiotics. I guess it's true about depression
> lowering your immune response.
>
> - Fred C. (who is still planning a response to the now-old-
autuerism thread)
Fred, that's what you get for getting promiscuous with academics
without proper protection. I mean they really are infectious. You
should have billed them for the $6000.
JPC
8517
From: Fred Camper
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:33am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
jpcoursodon wrote:
> Fred, that's what you get for getting promiscuous with academics
>without proper protection. I mean they really are infectious....
>
I know, I know; thanks for the laugh!
- Fred C.
8518
From: jpcoursodon
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:37am
Subject: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Fred Camper wrote:
>
>
> David Ehrenstein wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Hmm. Well I guess I'm not black, hunh?
> >
> >Jesus H. Mel-Gibson-on-the-Cross am I sick of this
> >crap!....
> >
> Thanks, David. I was hoping to hear you say something like that. In
> return, I promise to look the other way the next time you declare
Bette
> Davis an auteur.
>
> - Fred C.
Bette Davis as auteur is just David doing his gay schtick to
annoy the rest of us. Don't pay attention.
JPC
8519
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:05am
Subject: Re: Re: Sirk Spectacular
--- jpcoursodon wrote:
> Bette Davis as auteur is just David doing his
> gay schtick to
> annoy the rest of us. Don't pay attention.
>
> JPC
>
>
My life is not schtick -- though I'm a tummler at
heart.
__________________________________
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8520
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 5:25am
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Worrall"
wrote:
>
> I haven't seen Stanley Tong (who directed Chan in Police Story III
and
> IV) mentioned in the posts, and out all of the HK directors I think
he
> has the most sure hand in creating solid, clean and coherent action
> films. Maybe more conventional, but seeminglessly put together.
>
I'll add that "Swordsman II" is magnificent.
Paul
8521
From: Michael Worrall
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:19am
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
> Does this include Rumble in the Bronx????
I have yet to see the uncut version of this film. The only version I
have seen is the Miramax/Dimesnsion film version which had a lot cut
out. I do know that people have pointed out in the mountains in the
background, since it was shot in Vancouver, but that is pretty
superficial to me.
I am assuming, rightfully here I hope, that we are talking about the
HK versions here, not the Miraxed ver
8522
From: filipefurtado
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 6:15am
Subject: Re: Re: Auteur Wars, con'td
I think the problem here is what we have in mind when
discussing the concept of auteurism. Is it a matter of simple
auteur-spotting? If so I guess we could discuss who is the
major creative force behind a lot of films and come up if
different answers. I agree with Jonathan that Charlie Kaufman
is the major creative force behind all of the films made from
his scripts. So I guess in this sense he is the auteur. Now,
if you believe that the idea of auteurism has more to do with
an emphasis in direction, this isn’t that important. I agree
with Dan that the Clooney directed Confessions of a dangerous
Mind is a lot better than the two Kaufman’s films that were
directed by Spike Jonze. An no it’s not because he got a
better script (it doesn’t). Both Clooney and Jonze direction
serves their scripts more than are served by them, but
Clooney know how to shaped it a lot better. Jonze is always
trying to hard to top Kaufman (Damien put it well in a
discussion we ha, when he said that it was a case of a very
ironic direction to a very ironic script that ended canceling
itself), while Clooney does his tricks but integrated the
whole thing a lot better. Confessions ideas may mostly came
from Kaufman, but Clooney makes them solid an coherent, while
the Jonze films disintegrates somewhere in the middle point.
If the film works it’s because of Clooney far more than
Kaufman, he may very well make an awful film without the
support from a Kaufman script, but he is a far better matteur
en scene of Kaufmans ideas.
I do think that sometimes not a very solid direction can be
saved by someone else, cinematographers can make a mediocre
director make far more visually integrated film on occasion,
for example. But that don’t means the guy is necessarily the
film’s auteur. I never get why we have the need to label
every person who give a strong contribution to the film its
auteur. Let me give an example, one of the few Wyler films
that I like is Dodsworth. The film’s biggest strength is
Walter Huston’s performance. He makes for some of the usual
Wyler problems (but it’s worth mention than Wyler seems more
engaged an less studied than usual an that certainly helps).
Now, I wouldn’t call Huston the film’s auteur. On the
opposite side Audrey Hepburn charm can’t make Roman Hollyay
more than amusing in spots, by the film’s end she is defeated
by Wyler.
Filipe
---
Acabe com aquelas janelinhas que pulam na sua tela.
AntiPop-up UOL - É grátis!
http://antipopup.uol.com.br
8523
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 7:36am
Subject: Re: Mizoguchi and Japan (Was Need help with Hiroshi Shimizu films)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Richard Modiano"
wrote:
> He writes the text of the Heart Sutra on Genjuro.
Something I've wondered about -- the subtitles refer to this
as Sanskrit. Is it?
I'm fairly sure it's in Japanese script, but I suppose it could be
Sanskrit represented phonetically, or a combination of Japanese and
Sanskrit.
Paul
8524
From: Michael Worrall
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:37am
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..(Re-post)
Sorry, some of my post got cut off.
My friend Jack Angstreich is sending me the posts on HK filmmakers, so
I just could not resist started up again. I was very impressed with
Chan's first "Police Story" film, in particular the open sequence in
the shanty town. The editing, the clear placement of action, the jaw
dropping scene of Chan driving his car through the town and the great
homage to Keaton as Chan runs down the hill to catch the escaping
crime boss is first rate filmmaking to me. "Mr Canton and Lady Rose"
is a labor of love- and it is a bit labored in its self-consciousness-
but it shows a love of filmmaking that is pretty much absent in
today's commercial filmmaking.
I haven't seen Stanley Tong (who directed Chan in Police Story III and
IV) mentioned in the posts, and out all of the HK directors I think he
has the most sure hand in creating solid, clean and coherent action
films. Maybe more conventional, but seamlessly put together.
David Bordwell writes at length on Kirk Wong in his book "Planet Hong
Kong" which I recommend. Stephen Teo thinks Wong has a hamfisted
style and has the grace of a bull in a china shop. Bordwell also
devotes a whole chapter to Wong Jing, a director I have major problems
with, but I must admit that I found "God of Gamblers" to be
extraordinary. I recently watched Sammo Hung's "Moon Warriors" and
while I could do without the "Free Willy" sub-plot, it was a
delighful film, a very well made action/maitinee film. Tsui, to me,
resembles Eisenstein to a certain degree and displays some of his
8525
From:
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:01am
Subject: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
Fred Camper writes, (about a film historian):
"He later said that there was no visible difference between the styles of
Sirk, Ray and Minnelli. To me this simply showed that he had no eye for these
directors work at all, or for film style in general, .... But to me this claim
would be a like a musicologist saying that he couldn't tell the difference
between Bach, Handel, and Couperin."
I agree with Fred Camper and disagree with the film historian here.
And would go further.
Discussions like this point up the need to analyze and define the visual
styles of directors in concrete terms. Unless we can describe precisely the visual
styles of Sirk and Minnelli, how can we tell if they are the same or
different? How we teach students to understand the styles? Or convince people like the
above mentioned film historian that they are wrong?
That is why people should be trying to write in concrete detail about visual
style in film. My recent post on Fritz Lang and polygons was an example of
this. It is something concrete one can point to in Lang, a part of his visual
style. It is just a small portion of Lang's style - but progress always comes one
step at a time...
If some philistine tries to say that Lang's style is the same as Walsh's, one
has concrete evidence to the contrary. One can point out all these polygons,
and offer them as concrete evidence of Lang's style. Anyone with access to
Lang's films can inspect them, and SEE the evidence for THEMSELVES. It is
something anyone can see, too - everyone from Godard and Rivette to your Uncle Pete
and Aunt Sadie in Petoskie.
Yours for more mathematics in the study of film,
Mike Grost
8526
From: Matt Teichman
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:11pm
Subject: Re: Chan/Hung/Wong
Thank you for the recommendations (Bill, is it? Or "Hotlove"?) and a
provocative reading of CRIME STORY. I hadn't realized THE BIG HIT was
one of Kirk Wong's; interesting--I'll take that one over John Woo any
day. Of course I'm not the biggest Woo fan in the world, nor the
biggest action movie fan...
I'd been wanting to watch THE DEAD AND THE DEADLY, but the ghosts
succeeded in scaring me off. After your recommendation, however, I can
wait no longer (and I see it has the magnificent Lam Ching Ying).
Re: SWORDSMAN II (Paul's post)--there is a film for which it would be
useful to have some cultural background. A fascinating piece.
-Matt
hotlove666 wrote:
>What I saw in CRIME STORY - with the help of a multi-dialectal
>Chinese-speaking friend I saw it with - is an intelligent portrayal,
>within the limitations of the genre, of the situation of HK on the
>eve of the handover (Chan is left standing literally at the
>crossroads) - thematically. And visually, I find that Kirk Wong
>does the best combination of composition, lighting, editing and
>montage of any living HK action director - less ostentatious (God
>knows!) than John Woo, but filled with more long-range,
>finely-detailed satisfactions. Do see THE BIG HIT, as well as
>ROCK 'N' ROLL COP. I think Kirk Wong is seriously underrated.
>
>
8527
From: George Robinson
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 1:11pm
Subject: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
I seem to have missed the beginning of this thread. What reputable film
historian could possibly say he couldn't see the difference between Sirk,
Minnelli and Ray?
George (I can't tell the difference between
Duras, Robbe-Grillet and Claude Simon -- oh yeah, Robbe-Grillet is the one
who writes dirty books) Robinson
People say that life is the thing, but I prefer reading.
-- Logan Pearsall Smith
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 8:01 AM
Subject: [a_film_by] Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
> Fred Camper writes, (about a film historian):
> "He later said that there was no visible difference between the styles of
> Sirk, Ray and Minnelli. To me this simply showed that he had no eye for
these
> directors work at all, or for film style in general, .... But to me this
claim
> would be a like a musicologist saying that he couldn't tell the difference
> between Bach, Handel, and Couperin."
8528
From:
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:35am
Subject: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
My apologies: I changed the name of the thread. Fred Camper's quote is in his
first post on:
Re: Sirk Spectacular
This describes Fred Camper's visit to a fun-filled Sirk conference at
Dartmouth.
Seriously, I was distressed to read of Fred Camper's problems there.
Also, there is more on my web site on math and visual style, at:
http://members.aol.com/MG4273/zmath.htm
This article serves as a portal, with links to discussions of visual style in
various director articles.
Sorry for the confusion.
Mike Grost
PS. I was looking at a Monet at the DIA, but it turned out to be an Estruscan
funeral urn. They have the same visual style...
PPS My sister-in-law teaches Chinese Art History. She gave a lecture about
the "army" of giant terra cotta statues of ancient Chinese soldiers that were
recently exavated. One of her students started his term paper thus: "The terra
cotta statues, which are made of bronze..."
8529
From: samfilms2003
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:02pm
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..(Re-post)
"Michael Worrall" wrote:
>> Tsui, to me,
> resembles Eisenstein to a certain degree and displays some of his
his his ? ? your text got cut.
I'm interested, cause that's what I thought after seeing "Once Upon A Time In China" 1
& 3
-sam wells
8530
From: George Robinson
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 2:14pm
Subject: Re: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
I was looking at your website as linked in this e-mail -- fascinating stuff.
I spent fifteen years as a sportswriter and was enraptured when Bill James
and other "sabermetricians" began to use statistical analysis to challenge
the commonplaces of baseball strategy. I have long wondered why -- other
than the sheer tedium involved -- no one has done a more detailed
statistical analysis of film visual style. I know Barry Salt has done a lot
of work in this area but haven't been able to find much of his published
stuff.
It should be very easy to determine whether von Sternberg uses more slow
dissolves -- and slower ones at that -- than a typical Paramount director of
the early '30s -- just to give one example that comes to mind. When Sarris
makes a comparison between the cutting in Milestone's The Front Page and
Hawks's His Girl Friday, why can't someone sit down with a movieola and a
frame counter and verify it?
George (lousy at math) Robinson
People say that life is the thing, but I prefer reading.
-- Logan Pearsall Smith
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 8:35 AM
Subject: [a_film_by] Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
> My apologies: I changed the name of the thread. Fred Camper's quote is in
his
> first post on:
> Re: Sirk Spectacular
> This describes Fred Camper's visit to a fun-filled Sirk conference at
> Dartmouth.
> Seriously, I was distressed to read of Fred Camper's problems there.
>
> Also, there is more on my web site on math and visual style, at:
> http://members.aol.com/MG4273/zmath.htm
>
> This article serves as a portal, with links to discussions of visual style
in
> various director articles.
>
> Sorry for the confusion.
>
> Mike Grost
> PS. I was looking at a Monet at the DIA, but it turned out to be an
Estruscan
> funeral urn. They have the same visual style...
> PPS My sister-in-law teaches Chinese Art History. She gave a lecture about
> the "army" of giant terra cotta statues of ancient Chinese soldiers that
were
> recently exavated. One of her students started his term paper thus: "The
terra
> cotta statues, which are made of bronze..."
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
8531
From: Richard Modiano
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:37pm
Subject: Re: Mizoguchi and Japan (Was Need help with Hiroshi Shimizu films)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Gallagher" wrote:
"Something I've wondered about -- the subtitles refer to this
as Sanskrit. Is it?
I'm fairly sure it's in Japanese script, but I suppose it could be
Sanskrit represented phonetically, or a combination of Japanese and
Sanskrit."
The Heart Sutra ends with a mantra that's written in Sanskrit but the
text is written in Japanese characters,so 6 charcaters are written in
Sanskrit. In the episode in KWAIDAN called "Hoichi the Earless" the
assistant priest covers Hoichi's body with the sutra in black ink and
writes the syllables of the mantra in red ink. You get a much better
view of the written characters here since this is an important plot
point in the story (Spoiler: the demon tears off Hoichi's ears
because the priest failed to write the text on them.)
Richard
8532
From: Michael Worrall
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:41pm
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..(Re-post)
> I'm interested, cause that's what I thought after seeing "Once Upon
A Time In China" 1
> & 3
the last part was " resembles Eisenstein at times and displays some
of his sophistication." --I am using an older Netscape browser and I
think this may be the problem-the group page also loads improperly.--
I just recently saw "Swordsman II" and I am still digesting it, (many
of the HK films demand multiple viewings), and luckily I watch these
with my ex- who is Chinese and whose father versed him well in
Chinese history. Another director I would add to the list, though he
often functions as an action unit director, is Ching-Siu Tung, whose
1982 film "Duel to the Death" I find to be one of the best wuxia films
from the 80's and 90's
8533
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 4:51pm
Subject: Re: Chan/Hung/Wong
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Matt Teichman
wrote:
> Thank you for the recommendations (Bill, is it? Or "Hotlove"?) and
a
> provocative reading of CRIME STORY.
It's not mine - I got it from Marco Muller, the new head of the
Venice Festival, who lived on the mainland for a few years and is an
even better linguist than Serge Daney.
Sammo told me that he ended up directing THE DEAD AND THE DEADLY when
I interviewed him for the MR. NICE GUY presskit. He was encamped with
his beautiful wife in an unfurnished house out in the wilds of the
Valley, and barely spoke English. I worried about his future here.
Less than six months later he was starring in MARTIAL ARTS, an ABC
series about a Hong Kong cop in LA. These folks are pretty amazing.
Be careful - the ghosts are pretty scary.
Bill
8534
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 4:45pm
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Michael Worrall"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
> wrote:
>
> > Does this include Rumble in the Bronx????
>
> > I am assuming, rightfully here I hope, that we are talking about
the
> HK versions here, not the Miraxed versions.
I am - I wrote the presskit for Rumble before they made the cuts. The
kit included a 20-pp. bio of Chan that told New Line what they had -
they were expecting nothing from the film. Based on a prediction by
Mike Schlesinger, who would've loved to have Rumble at Sony, I
predicted $10 million opening weekend. New Line thought I was nuts,
but Mike, as usual, was right.
Even at full length, it's a mess.
8535
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 8:18pm
Subject: Re: Sirk Spectacular
Fred wrote:
> cost me about $6,000 more than I'd expected it to, because I
was there
> for six days on IV antibiotics. I guess it's true about depression
> lowering your immune response.
>
> - Fred C.
God, Fred, what an ordeal! These conferences are the pits. I
was actually very well treated at the one I attended recently in
Cambridge (although I was left at the wrong bed & breakfast and
wandered an hour in near-zero temperatures with my luggage
before finding the right one, the night before the conference - it
took me another hour to figure out where my room was and get
the door open), but the one before that, an Ulmer conference put
on by NYU and the New School, was a horror.
I didn't attend because I was ill, but I couldn't persuade them to
have my paper read. This was also my first contact with the
theory that people who do attend conferences pay their own way
and get reimbursed later - months later in some cases. A
teaching friend explained to me that this has become the policy
because too many people were pocketing expense advances
and not showing.
When I told the more competent of the 2 Ulmer organizers that I
was struggling to complete a new paper while putting in 8 hours
a day at a job, he told me not to bother, just to read a bit of
something old - the real point being, I gathered, to show up and
get paid (eventually). This was nice of him, but very depressing
when I thought about it. Maybe that's why I got sick, too!
The horror, the horror....
8536
From: George Robinson
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 10:04pm
Subject: More on The Passion
Garry Wills has an interesting piece on "The Passion of the Christ" in the
context of the problems of the contemporary Catholic Church in the new issue
of New York Review of Books. It's online at:
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/17026
g
People say that life is the thing, but I prefer reading.
-- Logan Pearsall Smith
8537
From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 10:50pm
Subject: Re: More on The Passion
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "George Robinson"
wrote:
> Garry Wills has an interesting piece on "The Passion of the
Christ" i
The best piece I've seen on the historical side of the film is a
short interview with Elaine Pagels in The New Yorker. Sorry I
don't have the issue number - maybe someone else can supply
it.
Marin Karmitz (MK2 Diffusion) has refused to show the film in his
theatres in France, describing it as "fascist." Karmitz is an old
lefty who made a militant film himself after May 68 and is one of
the premiere distributors of classy product, like the films of
Chabrol, which he often produces. Interestingly, he says he
based his judgement on things besides the portrayal of the
Jewish leaders in the film.
http://channels.netscape.com/ns/news/story.jsp?id=200403230
1260002871978&dt=20040323012600&w=RTR&coview=
8538
From: Robert Keser
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 11:11pm
Subject: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
I'm all for Mike's cry for precision in describing the
visuals that pass before our eyes in films. Recently,
while researching the films of Fred Zinnemann, I was
struck by how many different respectable sources,
including academic essays, kept referring to long takes
in one movie or another. Yet, when I watched the films
themselves, there are very few long takes (and I'm not
talking about Béla Tarr-length shots). However, there
are numerous instances of world-class seamless editing
in these films, so the various critics seemed to be reacting
to sequences that have the intensity of long takes, even
though they're in fact composed of shots of unexceptional length.
Another example is that many writings mention that High Noon
observes the Aristotelian unities of time and space, yet the 85
minute film covers action over a 105 minute period. Now, it seems
pedantic to point fingers at this discrepancy, but it's awfully
sloppy (and false) to describe the film this way. Maybe the harried
daily reviewer can be cut some slack, but to me this seems no
different from reporting that Braveheart is in Aramaic or Stuck On
You is about triplets.
Anyway, it's heartening that Mike has the scientist's
confidence that the steady drip-drip-drip accumulation of
observations will eventually wear through the stone of our still
relatively primitive tools for description. It's also great that,
thanks to Mike, we now know to look for polygons in Fritz
Lang.
We must also open our ears!
--Robert Keser
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
...point up the need to analyze and define the visual
> styles of directors in concrete terms...people should be trying to
write in concrete
detail about visual style in film. ... It is
> something anyone can see, too...
8539
From: Craig Keller
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 11:29pm
Subject: Re: Re: More on The Passion
> The best piece I've seen on the historical side of the film is a
> short interview with Elaine Pagels in The New Yorker. Sorry I
> don't have the issue number - maybe someone else can supply
> it.
It's a good piece, you're right -- in the Talk of the Town section,
March 8th issue, p. 26-7, by David Remnick.
craig.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8540
From: samfilms2003
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 0:24am
Subject: Re: Kirk Wong, Sammo Hung, etc..(Re-post)
> the last part was " resembles Eisenstein at times and displays some
> of his sophistication."
Yes, but I'd want to see more before trying to say much of anything about them...
> I just recently saw "Swordsman II" and I am still digesting it,
Not seen that one but in one viewing of "The East is Red" (which would be
'Swordsman III' ?) I certanly did not digest it ! Gotta go back to it sometime..
-sam
8541
From: Richard Modiano
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 0:44am
Subject: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
"Also, there is more on my web site on math and visual style, at:
http://members.aol.com/MG4273/zmath.htm
This article serves as a portal, with links to discussions of visual
style in various director articles."
Fascinating article Mike. Years ago when I worked at the Art
Students League of New York I went to a screening of THE PARADINE
CASE with an art student friend of mine who noticed that Hitchcock
had used the Divine Proportion for all the shots in the trial
sequence. She also said it occurred in STARNGERS ON A TRAIN when we
saw that on an earlier occasion. The ASL was (and still is)dedicated
to teaching art practice in the classic manner (in contrast to the
School of the Visual Arts, for example)so there was a certain amount
of theoretical study of the way paintings were created by Renaissance
masters. The Divine Proportion (sometimes called the Golden Mean)is
discussed by Cenino Cennini in his "Treatise on Painting" and just
about everyone who studied painting at the League read it. I believe
Hitchcock went to art school so it's very likely that he was familiar
with the Divine Proportion. I think it's called fie by mathmaticians
(I may have misremembered this.)
Richard
8542
From: Gabe Klinger
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 1:40am
Subject: Re: Walter Hill - Reminder
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Graham"
> Tonight's the first episode of "Deadwood", with Hill directing and
> featuring many of his stock: Keith Carradine, Powers Boothe, Peter
> Jason, etc.
>
> Should be great!
Did anyone see it? I watched the opening, but was too anxious to see the rest because
of a pending writing deadline. It looked strong, with obvious hints from Hawks. But
one thing that would never happen in Hawks' old west is someone barging through
the Sheriff's door without so much as knock or signal to let 'em know they are
approaching.
Gabe
8544
From: Aaron Graham
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 2:26am
Subject: Re: Walter Hill - Reminder
> Did anyone see it?
The first episode was worthwhile and reminded me a lot of Peckinpah's
early work for TV, especially "The Westerner" - a darker, more adult
frontier but with slightly more clearly defined heroes.
Keith Carradine as 'Wild Bill' Hickok is round two for Hill, as he
previously made WILD BILL (1995) with Jeff Bridges in the role.
Carradine plays him in his declining years, reflective towards his
past and living in the shadow of his legend.
The music was strong, although I wish they had of used Hill's
constant composter - Ry Cooder (although, it sounded very Cooder-ish
in the end credits.)
No Powers Boothe in this episode though; with Hill not directing next
week's episode I'm disappointed that it wasn't a "Southern
Comfort"/"Extreme Prejudice" reunion.
-Aaron
8545
From:
Date: Tue Mar 23, 2004 9:38pm
Subject: Re: Visual Style: Can You Prove It?
Richard Modiano writes:
"Years ago when I worked at the Art Students League of New York I went to a
screening of THE PARADINE CASE with an art student friend of mine who noticed
that Hitchcock had used the Divine Proportion for all the shots in the trial
sequence. She also said it occurred in STRANGERS ON A TRAIN."
This is the first I've heard of the Divine Proportion in film composition. It
was widely used in ancient Greek art (believe the Parthenon is laid out in
this ratio), and also in Renaissance painting and Symbolist art of the late 19th
Century. Have also read that it appears in the music of Debussy.
The Divine Proportion is also known as the Golden Ratio, and is written by
the lowercase Greek letter phi (do not know how to get the Greek character into
e-mail). This is pronounced "fie" (rhymes with pie).
phi times phi = phi + 1
There are whole books on the Golden Ratio. Martin Gardner gave a good
exposition in one of his Mathematical Games columns in Scientific American; the
column is reprinted in some of his book collections (he also has a good article on
Nim, the game in "Last Year at Marienbad"). His illustrations help explain why
the ratio is considered so graceful and harmonious.
I will watch for ratios of phi in film!
Thank you,
Mike Grost
8546
From: Aaron Graham
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 3:35am
Subject: Re: Walter Hill - Reminder / "Deadwood"
> Did anyone see it?
Armond White did: http://www.nypress.com/17/12/film/film2.cfm
(Just found this)...
8547
From: jpcoursodon
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:19am
Subject: Re: More on The Passion
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
> - >
> Marin Karmitz (MK2 Diffusion) has refused to show the film in his
> theatres in France, describing it as "fascist." Karmitz is an old
> lefty who made a militant film himself after May 68 and is one of
> the premiere distributors of classy product, like the films of
> Chabrol, which he often produces. Interestingly, he says he
> based his judgement on things besides the portrayal of the
> Jewish leaders in the film.
>
Clearly the Gospels are fascist and should be re-written for the
sake of political correctness.
I respect MK but he is in the throes of an ideological,
blindness-inducing ambiance that has condemned the film in France
(and probably in other countries too) before anybody has seen it. I
was asked to review it under the assumption that it was not only
objectionable but very bad anyway and when I said I didn't think it
was so I created consternation. It was a relief not to have to
attempt, against all odds, to defend a film that no decent, right-
thinking intellectual can possibly accept as anything but trash.
JPC
8548
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:45am
Subject: Re: More on The Passion
I
> was asked to review it under the assumption that it was not only
> objectionable but very bad anyway and when I said I didn't think it
> was so I created consternation. It was a relief not to have to
> attempt, against all odds, to defend a film that no decent, right-
> thinking intellectual can possibly accept as anything but trash.
>
> JPC
Who wanted you to review it, Monsieur C?
8549
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:51am
Subject: Mazursky on Showtime
There's a billboard on Sunset for Coast to Coast, a Paul Mazursky
film on Showtime - not yet aired, I believe. Interesting cast,
interesting writer, interesting director:
From imdb:
Directed by:
Paul Mazursky
Writing credits:
Frederic Raphael (novel)
Frederic Raphael (screenplay)
Richard Dreyfuss .... Barnaby Pierce
Judy Davis .... Maxine Pierce
Selma Blair .... Stacey Pierce
Maximilian Schell .... Casimir
Fred Ward .... Hal Kressler
Saul Rubinek .... Gary Pereira
John Salley .... Clifford Wordsworth
Paul Mazursky .... Stanly Tarto
8550
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 7:46am
Subject: Maths, statistics & film
"It should be very easy to determine whether von Sternberg uses more slow
dissolves -- and slower ones at that -- than a typical Paramount director of
the early '30s"
George, have you encountered Barry Salt's voluminous writing on 'statistical
style analysis'? He even wrote a piece on the dissolves in Sternberg, coming
to some appropriately mathematical - and somewhat banal - conclusion about
it !!!!!
Like Bordwell & Co, Salt despises - and offers his 'emprical' model as a
corrective to - 'thematic' analysis. By the same token, he despises Bordwell
& Co even more !! Salt is among the legendary obsessives of film analysis,
no doubt.
Adrian
8551
From: Craig Keller
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 7:20am
Subject: Johnny Guitar - The Musical
I passed this on Irving Place the other night -- had no idea until then
that it even existed. The Ben Brantley review from tomorrow's/today's
NY Times --
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/24/theater/reviews/24GUIT.html?8hpib
craig.
8552
From: Gabe Klinger
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 0:00pm
Subject: Re: Johnny Guitar - The Musical
Don't remember if it was discussed before, but the first 40 minutes of JOHNNY
GUITAR would be perfect for the stage !! From morning to night on the first day, Ray
(and Philip Yordan) are playing mostly with real-time (or some theatrical form of it).
And all you need is one set, basically. At the end you torch it, and your done.
I'm surprised it hasn't been adapted before.
BTW -- Thanks, Aaron, for the update on DEADWOOD.
Gabe
8553
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 1:36pm
Subject: Ruiz ROUGE book
For those on this list who are into the films of Raúl Ruiz and not yet aware
of this recent book on the subject, below are the contents and contact
details for RAUL RUIZ: IMAGES OF PASSAGE, edited by Helen Bandis, Grant
McDonald and myself (the editors of ROUGE, www.rouge.com.au). It was
launched at the Rotterdam Film Fest in January. Note that the contents of
the book are completely different from the contents of the Ruiz 'Annotated
Filmography' which comprises issue 2 of ROUGE - the pieces in the book are
not available on-line. Also note that the 3 texts by Ruiz himself are
completely new and exclusive to this book.
Raúl Ruiz: Images of Passage (Rouge Press/International Film Festival
Rotterdam, 2004)
Contents
PART I.
Waldo Rojas
Images of Passage
Benoît Peeters
Annihilating the Script: A Discussion with Raúl Ruiz
Christine Buci-Glucksmann
The Baroque Eye of the Camera (Part 1)
Adrian Martin
Displacements
PART II.
Raúl Ruiz
The Six Functions of the Shot
PART III.
Philippe Grandrieux
A Cinema of Friendship
Gilbert Adair
The Picture of Dorian Gray
Raúl Ruiz
The Comedy of Shadows
Marie-Luce Bonfanti
Vertigo of the Blank Screen
Raúl Ruiz
Tales for the Cast of That Day
Jean Miotte
Transparencies
Yann Rocher and
Cyril Béghin
An Interview with Jorge Arriagada
Bérénice Reynaud
Deux fois
Dorothea Keeser
Raúl Ruiz and Jean Miotte in the Café Mondrian
Select Bibliography
Select Web Resources
For trade and overseas orders please contact:
Books @ Manic
P.O. Box 8,
Carlton North 3054,
Victoria, Australia.
phone +61 3 9384 1437, fax +61 3 9384 1422
Raúl Ruiz: Images of Passage
is available from the following bookshops in Australia:
Melbourne
Brunswick Street Bookstore: 03 9416 1030
Collected Works: 03 9654 8873
Greville Street Bookstore: 03 9510 3531
NGV Bookshop, Federation Square: 03 8662 1542
The Paperback: 03 9662 1396
Readings Carlton: 03 9347 6085
Readings Hawthorn: 03 9819 1917
Sydney
Lamella Art Books: 02 4782 7311
Gleebooks: 02 96605144
MCA Store, Sydney: 02 9250 8458
Brisbane
Folio: 07 3221 1368
Queensland Art Gallery Store: 07 3840 7290
8554
From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 1:39pm
Subject: most set-ups in a day?
The year before last, I attended a pre-screening talk by John
Carpenter and Kent Jones, for THE THING (PRINCE OF DARKNESS was also
shown that night) at Lincoln Center. Carpenter and Jones were talking
about Roger Corman, and I think one of them said that Corman held the
world record for the most camera set-ups in a single day, and the
other (JC, I think) said no, it was Don Siegel.
Does anyone know? And what film, and how many set-ups?
Pure trivia, sorry.
-Jaime
8555
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 2:26pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
I'm not sure how many set-ups Corman managed on "The
Terror," but I understand that Raul Ruiz, on hearing
of the alleged number, set out to beat that record
with "Pointe de Fuite" in 1984.
--- "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> The year before last, I attended a pre-screening
> talk by John
> Carpenter and Kent Jones, for THE THING (PRINCE OF
> DARKNESS was also
> shown that night) at Lincoln Center. Carpenter and
> Jones were talking
> about Roger Corman, and I think one of them said
> that Corman held the
> world record for the most camera set-ups in a single
> day, and the
> other (JC, I think) said no, it was Don Siegel.
>
> Does anyone know? And what film, and how many
> set-ups?
>
> Pure trivia, sorry.
>
> -Jaime
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
8556
From: Michael Lieberman
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 2:37pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
If it counts for anything, Sam Fuller shot "Forty Guns" in five or so days, so wouldn't that top most?
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jaime N. Christley"
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:39:30 -0000
To: a_film_by@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [a_film_by] most set-ups in a day?
The year before last, I attended a pre-screening talk by John
Carpenter and Kent Jones, for THE THING (PRINCE OF DARKNESS was also
shown that night) at Lincoln Center. Carpenter and Jones were talking
about Roger Corman, and I think one of them said that Corman held the
world record for the most camera set-ups in a single day, and the
other (JC, I think) said no, it was Don Siegel.
Does anyone know? And what film, and how many set-ups?
Pure trivia, sorry.
-Jaime
Yahoo! Groups Links
--
___________________________________________________________
Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com
http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm
8557
From: jpcoursodon
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 3:08pm
Subject: Re: More on The Passion
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
> I
> > was asked to review it under the assumption that it was not only
> > objectionable but very bad anyway and when I said I didn't think
it
> > was so I created consternation. It was a relief not to have to
> > attempt, against all odds, to defend a film that no decent, right-
> > thinking intellectual can possibly accept as anything but trash.
> >
> > JPC
>
> Who wanted you to review it, Monsieur C?
I'll answer that privately if you don't mind, Mister K. I don't
want to get ad hominem.
JPC
8558
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:14pm
Subject: Re: Re: More on The Passion
--- jpcoursodon wrote:
> I'll answer that privately if you don't mind,
> Mister K. I don't
> want to get ad hominem.
> JPC
>
>
I see no reason to go into privacy mode. If you think
the film is good, why not say so? Is "TPOTC" really
all that different from "Good News," "Mother Wore
Tights," "The Navy vs. The Night Monsters" or "Ordet"?
In the immortal words of Alfred Hitchcock, "Ingrid,
it's just a movie."
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
8559
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:16pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
Well then there are Warhol's first sound films from
1965 (eg. "Harlot," "Horse," "Beauty #2") which
consisted of two 35 minutes reels shot without cuts in
real time.
--- Michael Lieberman wrote:
> If it counts for anything, Sam Fuller shot "Forty
> Guns" in five or so days, so wouldn't that top most?
>
> Mike
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jaime N. Christley"
> Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:39:30 -0000
> To: a_film_by@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [a_film_by] most set-ups in a day?
>
>
>
>
>
> The year before last, I attended a pre-screening
> talk by John
> Carpenter and Kent Jones, for THE THING (PRINCE OF
> DARKNESS was also
> shown that night) at Lincoln Center. Carpenter and
> Jones were talking
> about Roger Corman, and I think one of them said
> that Corman held the
> world record for the most camera set-ups in a single
> day, and the
> other (JC, I think) said no, it was Don Siegel.
>
> Does anyone know? And what film, and how many
> set-ups?
>
> Pure trivia, sorry.
>
> -Jaime
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
___________________________________________________________
> Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com
> http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
8560
From: Zach Campbell
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:33pm
Subject: Re: Mazursky on Showtime
Bill wrote:
> There's a billboard on Sunset for Coast to Coast, a Paul Mazursky
> film on Showtime - not yet aired, I believe. Interesting cast,
> interesting writer, interesting director:
Haven't we mentioned this here in the past? I know it was on my
radar for a while, but I had completely forgotten to keep an eye out
for premiere dates (not that I have Showtime anyway) until your
reminder, Bill. Does anyone know any advance word on COAST TO COAST?
Does anyone know what Lamont Johnson is up to, by the way? I don't
recall a conclusion on that before, maybe I'm forgetting something.
--Zach
8561
From: programming
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 4:43pm
Subject: Re: Ruiz ROUGE book
Adrian,
Can you let us know what the cost (with shipping to U.S.) is and whether we
can just mail or fax an order with Credit Card info? There is no email to
contact Books @ Manic directly.
Best,
Patrick F.
On 3/24/04 7:36 AM, "Adrian Martin" wrote:
>
>
> For trade and overseas orders please contact:
> Books @ Manic
> P.O. Box 8,
> Carlton North 3054,
> Victoria, Australia.
> phone +61 3 9384 1437, fax +61 3 9384 1422
>
8562
From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:55pm
Subject: Re: Mazursky on Showtime / Legend of the Seas
The Cinema Society of San Diego is having a cinema cruise to Mexican
Riveria 30-6JUN with Paul Mazursky as the guest and local MOPA film curator
Scott Marks as the host.
Royal Caribean Cruise on Legend of the Seas with reportedly good prices.
8563
From: Frederick M. Veith
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:27pm
Subject: Re: Ruiz ROUGE book
I happen to have this information handy.
The book is A$24.95 (about US$19 depending on the exchange rate). I was
billed under US$24, inclusive of shipping. They accept Visa, Mastercard.
Their e-mail is
It's a great book. I hope we can look forward to more from Rouge Press.
Fred.
On Wed, 24 Mar 2004, programming wrote:
> Adrian,
>
> Can you let us know what the cost (with shipping to U.S.) is and whether we
> can just mail or fax an order with Credit Card info? There is no email to
> contact Books @ Manic directly.
>
> Best,
>
> Patrick F.
8564
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:54pm
Subject: Re: Johnny Guitar - The Musical
> I passed this on Irving Place the other night -- had no idea until
then
> that it even existed. The Ben Brantley review from
tomorrow's/today's
> NY Times --
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/24/theater/reviews/24GUIT.html?8hpib
>
> craig.
Tom Farrell, the star of Ray's We Can't Go Home Again, sent it to me
this morning...with the observation that the play opened on
Crawford's birthday.
8565
From:
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 5:21pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
Jaime:
>...I think one of them said that Corman held the
> world record for the most camera set-ups in a single day, and the
> other (JC, I think) said no, it was Don Siegel.
>
> Does anyone know? And what film, and how many set-ups?
>
Whatever the number is, it's more likely a Hollywood-sanctioned
figure, as non-American films routinely go off the charts in
shooting speed. The Turks used to churn out a film in 4-6 days, back
in the mid-70s. And a friend who worked on a number of Hong Kong
films said that they averaged about 90 setups a day, which is sort
of mind-blowing by Hollywood standards.
That said, I don't know the answer to your question. My money would
be on Corman, though.
-Bilge
8566
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 7:10pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
> > Subject: [a_film_by] most set-ups in a day?
> >
Probably Ulmer, who could do 80 by not slating - he'd just put his
hand in front of the lens between shots. But there's lots of room for
exaggeration in these accounts. I really, really doubt that 40 Guns
was shot in 5 days. It is now well known that Dertour actually took 2
weeks and cost $150,000--the claim was always 6 days, $50,000.
However, $50,000 is apparently what Los Olvidados DID cost - 6 years
later!
This is a hard one to pin down without production reports. When I
interviewed Corman in '78 he debunked Ron Howard's claim to have done
90 by observing that he was using 5 cameras at once. When I asked him
to list the promising directors he'd started at New World he listed
them all - Dante, Demme etc. - and omitted Howard. When I asked about
Howard he said he thought that RH's acting career would keep him from
pursuing directing. What a diplomat!
8567
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:59pm
Subject: Re: Maths, statistics & film
Salt can be very useful. His technical history (not especially
mathematical) was constantly helpful when I was writing my Hitchcock
book. It also contains an appendix debunking Bellour's vehicle-
counting in his famous North By Northwest article by showing that the
same results could be obtained by flipping a coin. I haven't seen
Salt's lush co-authored tabletop book on European cinematography, but
I mention it now for anyone wondering what to give me for my birthday.
8568
From: Aaron Graham
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 10:32pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
> Does anyone know? And what film, and how many set-ups?
Could it possibly be "Little Shop Of Horrors"?
That was filmed entirely in one day because they were working against
the clock as the set had to be torn down the following Monday!
8569
From:
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:07pm
Subject: Lamont Johnson and Fielder Cook
Zach Campbell wrote:
>Does anyone know what Lamont Johnson is up to, by the way?
Apart from some episodes of "Felicity," it doesn't appear that he's directed
any feature-length pictures since the not-bad "All the Winters That Have Been"
in 1997. He's getting up there in age (he'll be 82 this year if IMDB's date
of birth info is correct), but that didn't stop Cukor and Vidor, to say
nothing of the still-active Antonioni and de Oliveira. Let's just hope he hasn't
been forced into retirement. I recommend a bunch of Johnson films very highly -
"Paul's Case," "The Last American Hero," "A Gunfight," "Lipstick," "One on
One," and "Lincoln" especially.
On the topic of tele-auteurs, does Fielder Cook have any rep?
Peter
8570
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:09pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Graham"
wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know? And what film, and how many set-ups?
>
> Could it possibly be "Little Shop Of Horrors"?
According to Corman's book, "How I Made a Hundred Movies
in Hollywood and Never Lost a Dime," it was "The Saga of the
Viking Women and Their Voyage to the Waters of the
Great Sea Serpent." "It turned into an insanely difficult shoot.
I hit my all-time record for most camera setups in a day --
seventy-seven."
Paul
8571
From: A R Ervolino
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:29pm
Subject: RE: Re: most set-ups in a day?
Anyone seen that movie? It's great! I actually only say it on MST3K
(Mystery Science Theatre 3000), of which I am a HUGE fan (even made my
own working Tom Servo)
> it was "The Saga of the Viking Women and Their Voyage to the Waters of
the Great Sea Serpent." "It turned into an insanely difficult shoot.
I hit my all-time record for most camera setups in a day --
seventy-seven."
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8572
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:57pm
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "A R Ervolino"
wrote:
> Anyone seen that movie? It's great! I actually only saw it on
MST3K
> (Mystery Science Theatre 3000), of which I am a HUGE fan
(even made my
> own working Tom Servo)
>
> > it was "The Saga of the Viking Women and Their Voyage to
the Waters of
> the Great Sea Serpent."
I taped it off MST3K - haven't seen it yet. Lawrence Goldman
wrote it – he also wrote The 30 Foot Bride of Candy Rock and
Kronos, a very dumb movie about a giant robot from space with
pistons for legs. How that equated to forward motion was a
mystery to me even at age 10.
There are people who would take it very ill that you are a fan of
MST3K, but I'll admit to enjoying it when the movie deserves the
abuse. As someone - Jonathan Rosenbaum? - has said, it
would be more fun if they threw in an occasional bad film with a
big budget or an undeserved reputation as great art.
Highly recommended: Attack of the Bat Monsters, an excellent
low-budget film a clef about the making of a Corman 3-day
wonder which Joe Dante discovered at a local festival. I reviewed
it on imdb and meant every word.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0228037/usercomments
8573
From: Aaron Graham
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 0:05am
Subject: Re: Lamont Johnson / "Last American Hero"
>>"The Last American Hero,"
I, amazingly, got to this this particular feature at a car show a
couple of years ago and highly recommend it as well.
I'd certainly rate it the best Johnson film I've seen; on par with
his excellent "Twilight Zone" eps.
PS to Peter: I've been having trouble with my e-mail lately and was
curious if you received the Fleischer interview I was meaning to send
to you?
-Aaron
8574
From: jpcoursodon
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 0:15am
Subject: Re: More on The Passion
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:
>
> --- jpcoursodon wrote:
>
> > I'll answer that privately if you don't mind,
> > Mister K. I don't
> > want to get ad hominem.
> > JPC
> >
> >
> I see no reason to go into privacy mode. If you think
> the film is good, why not say so? Is "TPOTC" really
> all that different from "Good News," "Mother Wore
> Tights," "The Navy vs. The Night Monsters" or "Ordet"?
>
> In the immortal words of Alfred Hitchcock, "Ingrid,
> it's just a movie."
>
> _______David you misunderstood me! I was not referring to the film
but to the party who asked me to review it then got upset when I said
I liked it. He gasped (on the phone) as though I had confessed that
I had just strangled my mother and raped a little boy.No point in
mentioning on this forum who the party is... Otherwise, I wouldn't
mind at all defending the film. Except that I would have to spend so
much time explaining that I'm not anti-semitic. And dealing with
issues that have little if anything to do with whether the movie is
good, bad or mediocre.
I didn't read your diatribes against TPOTC at the time
because I didn't want to be influenced before I saw it. Maybe I'l go
back to them now. Unfortunately I haven't seen "The Navy vs. the
Night Monsters" so I can't compare.
JPC
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
8575
From: Zach Campbell
Date: Wed Mar 24, 2004 11:58pm
Subject: On the topic of tele-auteurs
Peter:
> On the topic of tele-auteurs, does Fielder Cook have any rep?
I'm not familiar with him. But here are some excerpted comments by
Richard Corliss on tele-auteurs in 1975 that I thought some here
might find interesting:
Steven Spielberg: "Canny and super-slick, Spielberg could, with
application, become the next George Roy Hill."
Donald Wrye: "his background in 16-mm realism and his obvious
rapport with teen-aged actors have made his TV movies both tougher
and more accessible than the run-of-the-treadmill product."
John Badham: "The Friedkin of the small screen. Street-smart
cheekiness and an appreciation of The System's absurdities combined
to make THE LAW 1974's most enjoyable TV movie."
Joseph Sargent: "On TV Sargent specializes in cultural tensions--
usually between well-meaning straights and crafty denizens of either
the underworld ... or the undeground."
Gilbert Cates: "it should be added that Cates has an undeniable way
with actors"
Lamont Johnson: "On TV he's handled Stanley Kramer-type projects
with the same care for nuances and idiosyncracies [as on the big-
screen] .... Only once has the script's Importance overwhelmed
Johnson: with THE EXECUTION OF PRIVATE SLOVIK (1974)."
John Korty: "The TV-movie format provided Korty with [a narrative
drive], and both he and the medium have benefitted from it. ...
Korty proved that TV movies can be socially responsible without
being sociologically smug."
John Llewellyn Moxey: "When working with Richard Matheson, Moxey
could turn out classy schlock: a beautiful atmospheric pilot film
for GHOST STORY (1972), or a seedy cross-breeding of DRACULA and THE
FRONT PAGE in THE NIGHT STALKER (1971)."
--Zach
8576
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 0:36am
Subject: Re: Johnny Guitar - The Musical
http://www.nypost.com/entertainment/21684.htm
Wagnerian...
8577
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 1:55am
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "A R Ervolino"
wrote:
> Anyone seen that movie? It's great! I actually only say it on MST3K
> (Mystery Science Theatre 3000), of which I am a HUGE fan (even made
my
> own working Tom Servo)
That's where I saw it too. I was trying to remember some comment
made on MST3K, maybe by Tom Servo -- something like, maybe the
Psychotronic guys are wrong, and Corman isn't a good director...
The subject of Corman's films inspired an argument on a show about
MST3K:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=32ED429E.8E7%40ix.netcom.com
My guess is that Mike's attitude toward cheesy movies is
different from Joel's.
There have been a handful of auteurist favorites on MST3K: Bava's
Diabolik, Cottafavi's Hercules Conquers Atlantis, and Ulmer's
The Amazing Transparent Man. Ptushko's Sampo and Sadko are
well regarded in their Russian versions, before they became
"The Magic Voyage of Sinbad" and "They Day the Earth Froze"
with Coppola's help. Some of Raymond Durgnat's favorites have
been on MST3K: the Hercules films, This Island Earth, and
First Spaceship on Venus.
Paul
8578
From: Hadrian
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 3:36am
Subject: Schrader on "The Passion"
This is from a longer article on the whole "Excorsist" Fiasco.
Thought you might be interested in what Hollywood's local theologian
has to say:
> In the meantime, he has found time to take in a few movies. He
> recently saw Mel Gibson's The Passion of the Christ, which he
> describes as a very different beast to 1988's Last Temptation of
> Christ. "I thought it was medieval. My guess is that Mel has a
> problem with the Enlightenment, because his film really does go
back
> to the visceral cult origins of Christianity, and the fervour it
has
> created is more akin to a Gospel tent meeting than a motion
picture."
> He takes a hit of coffee. "I'm just troubled by it. It's a kind of
> primitive religion that I don't want to return to. It reminds me
more
> of Shiites than it does of Episcopalians."
8579
From: Hadrian
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 3:52am
Subject: Re: Schrader on "The Passion"
Ahem. "Exorcist".
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Hadrian" wrote:
> This is from a longer article on the whole "Excorsist" Fiasco.
> Thought you might be interested in what Hollywood's local
theologian
> has to say:
>
8580
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 3:57am
Subject: Re: Re: More on The Passion
--- jpcoursodon wrote:
He gasped (on the phone) as though I had
> confessed that
> I had just strangled my mother and raped a little
> boy.
Or maybe just pushed an oldlady in a wheelchair down
aflight of stairs like Richard Widmakr in "Kiss of
Death."
I wouldn't
> mind at all defending the film. Except that I would
> have to spend so
> much time explaining that I'm not anti-semitic.
I should think not. The film's anti-semitism is both
blatant and obscure. Unlike that of two far more
important anti-semites I can name: Celine and Wagner.
I would imagine Gibson fancies himself a combination
of both on some level (if he knew who the former was.)
And
> dealing with
> issues that have little if anything to do with
> whether the movie is
> good, bad or mediocre.
> I didn't read your diatribes against TPOTC
> at the time
> because I didn't want to be influenced before I saw
> it.
My diatribe was more against Mel's exploitation of the
film than the film itself.
Maybe I'l go
> back to them now. Unfortunately I haven't seen "The
> Navy vs. the
> Night Monsters" so I can't compare.
>
Mamie Van Doren was born to play Mary Magdalene,IMO.
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
8581
From: Aaron Graham
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 4:00am
Subject: Re: Schrader on "The Passion"
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Hadrian" wrote:
> This is from a longer article on the whole "Excorsist" Fiasco.
> Thought you might be interested in what Hollywood's local
theologian
> has to say:
Do you have a link to the entire Schrader article?
I'd like to read his comments on his "Exorcist".
-Aaron
8583
From: A R Ervolino
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 4:54am
Subject: RE: Re: most set-ups in a day?
>There are people who would take it very ill that you are a fan of
>MST3K,
MST3K is funny . I am one that will poke fun out of things that I love
very much. Taking it from the point of view from someone like Kevin
Murphy (Tom Servo), he knows movies, and almost the whole cast holds
many of the same films highly as we would. What MST3K did was allowed
people to see movies that they wouldn't have before. It has brought an
awareness to B-Movies, many of which you can for the first time buy in
their full format thanks to the exposure from MST3K. I just am one that
believes if you can take it seriously, then you can also poke fun.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8584
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 6:40am
Subject: Re: most set-ups in a day?
>
> There have been a handful of auteurist favorites on MST3K: Bava's
> Diabolik, Cottafavi's Hercules Conquers Atlantis, and Ulmer's
> The Amazing Transparent Man.
First of all, where else am I going to SEE Hercules Conquers
Atlantis? And I'd like to hear their take on Transparent Man. I'll
see if I can track that one down.
8585
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 6:42am
Subject: Re: Schrader on "The Passion"
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Aaron Graham"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Hadrian" wrote:
> > This is from a longer article on the whole "Excorsist" Fiasco.
> > Thought you might be interested in what Hollywood's local
> theologian
> > has to say:
>
> Do you have a link to the entire Schrader article?
> I'd like to read his comments on his "Exorcist".
>
> -Aaron
Once you do, you may want to read Caleb Carr's fairly public comments
on Schrader. It's probably on google somewhere.
8586
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 6:51am
Subject: Re: Schrader on "The Passion"
> > Do you have a link to the entire Schrader article?
> > I'd like to read his comments on his "Exorcist".
> >
> > -Aaron
>
> Once you do, you may want to read Caleb Carr's fairly public
comments on Schrader. It's probably on google somewhere.
Here's a bowdlerized version:
http://www.horrorexpress.com/news.php?newsid=311
8587
From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 7:45am
Subject: ah yes (was Re: most set-ups in a day?)
> According to Corman's book, "How I Made a Hundred Movies
> in Hollywood and Never Lost a Dime," it was "The Saga of the
> Viking Women and Their Voyage to the Waters of the
> Great Sea Serpent." "It turned into an insanely difficult shoot.
> I hit my all-time record for most camera setups in a day --
> seventy-seven."
That sounds correct - it was a long and beautifully ridiculous title
that got a laugh from the audience.
It was either Kent Jones or Carpenter who, before being corrected with
the Corman title, said the record-holder was Siegel's NIGHT UNTO
NIGHT. Don't hold me to that. It was definitely one of Siegel's
early films.
THE LINEUP is really good, I was happy to discover. Amazing
conclusion (and events leading up).
"Aren'cha gonna say somethin'?"
"You're dead."
-Jaime
8588
From: Samuel Bréan
Date: Thu Mar 25, 2004 9:33am
Subject: Re: Re: More on The Passion
Thanks for the reference. This article is online :
http://www.newyorker.com/talk/content/?040308ta_talk_remnick
>It's a good piece, you're right -- in the Talk of the Town section,
>March 8th issue, p. 26-7, by David Remnick.
_________________________________________________________________
MSN Messenger http://g.msn.fr/FR1001/866 : un logiciel gratuit pour
dialoguer avec vos amis !
8589
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 5:38pm
Subject: Ripleymania
More good news from the Cinematheque, for Arthur (THUNDER
ROAD, CANDLE IN THE WIND) Ripley fans who live in LA or
have frequent flyer miles: their April noir series will include a 35
print of THE CHASE, long impossible - or very, very hard - to see.
Well, I sure haven't seen it. Now if they can just find PRISONER
OF JAPAN...
8590
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 5:52pm
Subject: Help locating Bunuel tapes
Does anyone have or know where I can get:
Cela s'appelle l'aurore
Espana leal en armes
His cutdown of Triumph of the Will
La hija del engano - Mexican version?
8591
From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 7:24pm
Subject: "Hidalgo" is being criticized in Saudi Arabia
The new Disney movie "Hidalgo" is being criticized in Saudi Arabia
as a careless misinterpretation of Arab history and culture.
http://query.nytimes.com/mem/tnt.html?tntget=2004/03/25/movies/
25HIDA.html&tntemail1
There are a variety of reasons for criticizing HIDALGO. Mostly, I
felt it was billed as a thoroughbred and ended up being a mudder
(perhaps duster is more appropriate).
I felt the HOLLYWOOD ARROGANCE appropriate criticism, even if Hildago
is only a movie, as it was presented as something greater than a
movie.
8592
From: Elizabeth Nolan
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 7:40pm
Subject: Majors say they'll back digital cinema via exhib subsidies
I, as many here do, prefer FILM but I think digital cinema will soon be
here and hopefully will contribute to better FILMS (the few that get
made).
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr/article_display.jsp?
vnu_content_id=1000471668
8593
From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 8:10pm
Subject: ATSAS screenings
Don't know if any of you are well positioned to attend, but my film ALL
THE SHIPS AT SEA is playing in two upcoming festivals. Next weekend,
it's at the Longbaugh Film Festival in Portland, OR:
Sat., April 3, 6:30 pm
Sun., April 4, noon
Hollywood Theatre
4122 NE Sandy Blvd
Portland, Oregon
$8 all-day admission
There's some info about the festival at http://www.longbaugh.com.
There's a small possibility that the showtime of the film will be
changed, so check the schedule on the web site before you come. I'll be
at the Saturday screening.
Then the film will be at the Riverrun Film Festival in Winston-Salem, NC
on Saturday, April 24 at 10 am. I don't know the location yet, but
information will be up soon at http://riverrunfilm.com/home_2004.htm.
I'll probably attend.
Check with me if you want more info. - Dan
8594
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 8:22pm
Subject: Re: ATSAS screenings
I'll let Sean Levy (press guy) and Llolyd Cohen (distributor) know
- they're both in Portland.
8595
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 8:23pm
Subject: Re: ATSAS screenings
I'll let Sean Levy (press guy) and Llolyd Cohen (distributor) know
- they're both in Portland.
8596
From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 8:34pm
Subject: Re: Re: ATSAS screenings
> I'll let Sean Levy (press guy) and Llolyd Cohen (distributor) know
> - they're both in Portland.
That's the Lloyd Cohn that we used to know in LA? It'd be great to see
him again.
I have a friend whose mother worked uncredited on the script of CANYON
PASSAGE when she was a UCLA student. (I believe that Ernest Pascal was
her professor, and drafted two students to help him.) When Lloyd met my
friend and heard about her mother's connection to greatness, he got on
his knees and bowed to the ground! My friend was mighty perplexed, as
both she and her mother believe that CANYON PASSAGE is a piece of junk.
- Dan
8597
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 9:30pm
Subject: Re: ATSAS screenings
>
> That's the Lloyd Cohn that we used to know in LA? It'd be great
to see
> him again.
>
> I have a friend whose mother worked uncredited on the script
of CANYON
> PASSAGE when she was a UCLA student. (I believe that
Ernest Pascal was
> her professor, and drafted two students to help him.) When
Lloyd met my
> friend and heard about her mother's connection to greatness,
he got on
> his knees and bowed to the ground! My friend was mighty
perplexed, as
> both she and her mother believe that CANYON PASSAGE is a
piece of junk.
> - Dan
Lloyd distributes all of Akerman and Ruiz and Ripley that he can
get his mitts on: World Artists - they have a website. He's one of
my heroes.
8598
From: Zach Campbell
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 10:15pm
Subject: JEZEBEL, Davis, Wyler, auteurs
Thomas Schatz -- hardly an auteurist -- wrote an article for the
reader THE STUDIO SYSTEM, called "'A Triumph of Bitchery': Warner
Bros., Bette Davis, and JEZEBEL." In it, he writes about the making
of JEZEBEL and its reception, and while he underlines the importance
of William Wyler as a creator of meaning and coherence in the film.
Some excerpts:
"Even with the delays and the escalating costs, though, Wyler's
authority over the shoot was never directly challenged."
...
"A studio-based director was simply another department head on an
assembly-line operation, but his was one department--
i.e., "principal photography"--that was sacrosanct in the filmmaking
process, and his authority was usurped only in the most extreme of
circumstances. That was due largely to the director's privileged
and delicate rapport with his performers, which in the case of
JEZEBEL was of grave concern."
...
"But it was Wyler's direction, as much as the script or Davis's
performance, that brought Julie Marston to life and shaped the
viewer's conception of both that character and the story. This
involved more than simply lighting and shot composition, although
Wyler and cinematographer Ernie Haller did capture Davis's physical
beauty as no previous Warners filmmakers had done. Even more
important was Wyler's ability, through camerawork and cutting, to
situate Julie as the governing sensibility of the story."
As I said, Schatz hardly ignores Davis' role in the creation of the
film (or her value as its star), but he links it (as well as the
lift John Huston got from the film) to the close relationship she
had to Wyler. Not that Davis and Huston had the same type of
relationship with Wyler at the time ... as far as I know.
Thought this might make for some interesting reading vis-a-vis
JEZEBEL and auteurism. I vow to see JEZEBEL myself before too
long. Started reading Schatz's THE GENIUS OF THE SYSTEM yesterday:
informative stuff.
--Zach
8599
From: Jonathan Rosenbaum
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:15pm
Subject: Re: Help locating Bunuel tapes
His cutting down of "Triumph of the Will" was done for Museum of
Modern Art, so somebody there would probably know.
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
> Does anyone have or know where I can get:
>
> Cela s'appelle l'aurore
> Espana leal en armes
> His cutdown of Triumph of the Will
> La hija del engano - Mexican version?
8600
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Mar 26, 2004 11:19pm
Subject: Re: Help locating Bunuel tapes
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan Rosenbaum"
wrote:
> His cutting down of "Triumph of the Will" was done for Museum
of
> Modern Art, so somebody there would probably know.
>
I know - who do I call? (All answers accepted except
"Ghosbusters.")
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