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Posts From the Internet Film Discussion Group, a_film_by

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8701

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 0:40pm
Subject: Re: Re: Mazursky on Showtime/COAST to COAST airing 4/4 and 4/10, SHOWTIME

I ran into Paul at the opening of the City of
Lights/City of Angels Film Festival last night. He has
a part in it too. "Of course I had an in with the
director," he said.

--- Elizabeth Anne Nolan wrote:
> COAST to COAST airing SUNDAY 4/4 and 4/10 on
> Showtime, several screenings
>
> > Bill wrote:
> > > There's a billboard on Sunset for Coast to
> Coast, a Paul Mazursky
> > > film on Showtime - not yet aired, I believe.
> Interesting cast,
> > > interesting writer, interesting director:
>
>
>

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8702

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 5:42pm
Subject: free DVD of a restored film (sort of off-top)

An entrepreneur has figured out that the plastic lid on cups for drinks sold
at movies, ballparks, arenas, etc is about the size of a CD / DVD. He wants
to market such for advertising.

Unfortunately, he has not figured out that the CD / DVD is a perfect flying
disc (personally, I have not tried it at home)! ...probably will be prohibited in
movies, ballparks, arenas, but OK for 7-11 and like.
8703

From: hotlove666
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 6:50pm
Subject: Re: free DVD of a restored film (sort of off-top)

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth Anne Nolan"
wrote:
> An entrepreneur has figured out that the plastic lid on cups for
drinks sold
> at movies, ballparks, arenas, etc is about the size of a CD /
DVD. He wants
> to market such for advertising.
>
> Unfortunately, he has not figured out that the CD / DVD is a
perfect flying
> disc (personally, I have not tried it at home)! ...probably will be
prohibited in
> movies, ballparks, arenas, but OK for 7-11 and like.

Spoken like a specialist in child psychology and emergency
medicine!
8704

From: Chris Fujiwara
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 8:34pm
Subject: Jet Pilot mysteries

Hello everyone:

A friend of mine who loves Jet Pilot and recently watched a
letterboxed DVD of the film has asked me some questions which I can't
answer, and which I have occasionally wondered about, too: who
directed what parts of the film, and in what aspect ratio(s)? I've
only seen the film in 1.33 (on 16mm and on TV). According to my
friend, who has an experienced eye for such things, the film looks
fine, shot by shot, at the DVD's aspect ratio of about 1.85:1 or 2:1,
and, he says, in fact looks better, compositionally, at that ratio
than in Academy ratio.

I believe that Sternberg worked on the film in 1949 or 1950 (or
1951?) - when, I assume, he would have shot the film for 1.33 - and
that, on Howard Hughes's orders, and perhaps under his direction,
retakes and added scenes were shot at various times before the film's
release in 1957. By then, the original studio, RKO, had gone out of
business (Universal-International released Jet Pilot). According to
James Limbacher's book Four Aspects of the Film, Jet Pilot was
released in SuperScope, which would suggest that the pre-1954 footage
was cropped at top and bottom.

Does anybody here know more about the intended aspect ratio of the
film? And does anybody know more about who directed the post-
Sternberg scenes, which ones they were, and when they were shot? Was
Ray involved? Jules Furthman?

Thanks,
Chris
8705

From: Henrik Sylow
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 9:43pm
Subject: Re: free DVD of a restored film (sort of off-top)

I can alread see the lawsuit:

I was tired, so I didn't notice there was a "lid" on the coffee, so
I cut myself. Now I want $100 million dollars.

PS: The movie wasnt even good.

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth Anne Nolan"
> wrote:
> > An entrepreneur has figured out that the plastic lid on cups for
> drinks sold
> > at movies, ballparks, arenas, etc is about the size of a CD /
> DVD. He wants
> > to market such for advertising.
> >
> > Unfortunately, he has not figured out that the CD / DVD is a
> perfect flying
> > disc (personally, I have not tried it at home)! ...probably
will be
> prohibited in
> > movies, ballparks, arenas, but OK for 7-11 and like.
>
> Spoken like a specialist in child psychology and emergency
> medicine!
8706

From: L C
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 10:16pm
Subject: Mounties and Bedouins Was "Hidalgo"

Reading the article in the NYTimes about "Hidalgo", I felt as a Canadian reading the same things again. Pierre Berton in 1975 published "Hollywood's Canada: The Americanization of Our National Image" in which for example at p.211-214 ,he criticized Anthony Mann's "The Far Country" for showing gunfights in the Yukon Territory during the Gold Rush, a place completly controlled by the Mounties. See also http://www.wlu.ca/~wwwpress/jrls/cjc/BackIssues/23.4/gittings.htmlAs some would say "nihil nove sub sole" or "plus ça change, plus c'est pareil". I find the screenwriter Fusco 'reaction to the criticisms "it's only a movie" a little short.

Luc

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8707

From:
Date: Tue Mar 30, 2004 5:22pm
Subject: Re: free DVD of a restored film (sort of off-top)

In the ironically titled action film "I Come In Peace" (Craig R. Baxley,
1991), an alien invades Earth (or, at least, Houston). His weapon: what look like
jet-propelled CD's, that fly through the air, and destroy anything in their
path. It's not that great a film, but the CD's are pretty unforgettable. There
are some funny satiric moments, too.
This is one of the few theatrical films for former stunt coordinater turned
TV director Baxley. Recently he has been house director for Stephen King
miniseries, such as "Kingdom Hospital" (not seen here).
US Schools had to send home notices in the early 1990's, begging parents not
to let their kids watch "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles" at home - the kids were
kickboxing everyone in sight on the play ground... I'm sure I don't want to
be in a football stadium full of flying CD's!

Mike Grost
8708

From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 9:18am
Subject: Ella Enchanted

The above-referenced film, Miramax's first try at a "Disney"
(=family) film, opening soon, is directed by Tommy O'Haver, whom I
have touted in earlier posts. It's his third feature after Billy's
Hollywood Screen Kiss and Get Over It! Like the latter, it has
musical numbers. He's a director whose shorts and first features are
distinctive. Who knows how this turned out, with Frog Prince Harvey
overseeing the production. Break a leg, Tommy!
8709

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 4:35pm
Subject: LADYKILLERS

I found no archived posts for LADYKILLERS and don't recall any.

The original LADYKILLERS is delightful; not so, the COENS' recent
effort.

Rosenbaum's LADYKILLERS (both original and recent) review

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/click/author-18/reviews.php?
rid=1266772&cats=1%2C+2%2C+3%2C+4%2C+5%2C+7%2C+8%2C+29%2C+
12%2C+13%2C+14%2C+16%2C+17%2C+18%2C+19%2C+20%2C+21%2C+22%2C+24%2C
+23%2C+26%2C+27&genreid=&switches=&letter=&sortby=&page=1

is well worth reading regarding the recent posts of lack of
originality, not because of the "remake," but because of the remake's
failure to capture the essence of the original, the "BRITISH"
character.
8710

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 4:45pm
Subject: INFERNAL AFFAIRS

I saw all three parts of INFERNAL AFFAIRS at the PALM SPRINGS
INTERNATIONAL FF last Jan, in a middle (core of the story), first,
and last part of the story order, apparently as filmed.

I saw the middle part of the story on a mid-festival night, late and
when it was over near midnight, found four (at least 70 yo) Palm
Spring ladies remarking about what a good story they had just seen,
and looking forward to the other screening. Certainly these were
not the focus group for INFERNAL AFFAIRS.

I saw the middle core part again in Santa Monica Film Market in Feb
and would see it again
8711

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:28pm
Subject: Re: LADYKILLERS

> The original LADYKILLERS is delightful; not so, the COENS' recent
> effort.

I must be the only person on the planet who doesn't like the
Mackendrick film. Haven't seen the remake yet.

-Jaime
8712

From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 5:56pm
Subject: Re: LADYKILLERS

Here's my review of the film for The Economist. Sorry, I can't post a
link, because to read anything on their web site you have to
subscribe.

POE RELATIONS

This remake of the 1955 classic THE LADYKILLERS is very funny, but
Tom Hanks, playing a genteel Southern version of the role created by
Alec Guinness, is not. This is no fault of Mr. Hanks, a resourceful
actor who trumps the dentures Mr. Guinness deployed to memorable
effect in the original with a convulsive laugh - half sneeze, half
whinny - which subtly suggests that Poe-loving criminal mastermind
Goldthwait Higginson Dorr, Ph. D., is deranged.

As he would have to be to assemble such a crew of co-conspirators:
Gawain MacSam (Marlon Wayans), the foul-mouthed inside man at the
riverboat casino Dorr plans to rob; The General (Tzi Ma), a former
Vietcong tunnel rat enlisted to burrow into the casino's land-locked
counting room; Lump Hudson (Ryan Hurst), a behemoth too feeble-minded
for football; and self-proclaimed demolitions expert Garth Pancake
(J. K. Simmons), whose pathetic desire to be known as a "go-to guy"
prompts him to describe any challenge he is presented with as "the
easiest thing in the world."

The filmmakers have also given their star a formidable straight woman
to play off of. Irma P. Hall is wonderful as Marva Munson, the black
landlady whose conveniently located root cellar Dorr is using for
rehearsals of his "early Renaissance consort." A devout Mississippi
churchwoman, Marva divides her time between Dionysian gospel services
and conversations with her departed husband Othar, whose portrait
hangs over the hearth of her humble home. Confronted with Dorr and
his implausible band of music-makers, she alternates between
glowering suspicion and grinning appreciation of her gentleman
boarder's eccentricities. She is goodness incarnate.

THE LADYKILLERS is set in a depopulated backwater where the only
going concerns are the floating den of vice and Marva's tiny church--
campaign posters for the town's black sheriff (George Wallace) urge
voters to re-elect him because he's "too old to go to work." In the
scene where Marva tries to introduce the Sheriff to her reluctant
boarder, the filmmakers keep his expressions out of focus and at
arm's length while he is coming to the conclusion that "Professor
Dorr" is Marva's imaginary friend, making this a comic high point of
the film. Others involve a bulldog suffocated by a gas mask, tender
memories of a weekend for Irritable Bowel Singles in the Catskills
and an endless procession of garbage scows that seem to be there
whenever Dorr needs to throw a cadaver off the town's bridge --
silent emissaries of an implacable destiny.

This brings us back to the mystery of Mr. Hanks' failure to be funny,
which is entirely the fault of the painfully arch, multi-syllabic
dialogue the Coen brothers have saddled him with. A failure of taste,
not of talent, their verbal malfeasance extends to the Rabelaisian
jeremiads they have written for Mr. Wayans, who normally could get
laughs from this kind of thing in his sleep--halfway into the film
his sallies start dropping like flies, and the crooks' ensemble
scenes never recover.

Happily, the Coens are gifted visual comedians, and they are abetted
in THE LADYKILLERS by a cast as good as that of the 1955 original.
Perhaps Dorr's fondness for Edgar Allen Poe is their tacit
confession, for when Hanks recites the same verse from "To Helen"
twice, we are forced to reflect that the Divine Edgar was a dreadful
versifier, although that did not keep him from being a great poet. In
a way, the eminence the Coens have achieved as filmmakers is even
more impressive, because to get there they had to overcome not two
tin ears, but four.

Note for a_film_byers: It's interesting that Joel and Ethan share the
director credit on Ladykillers - a first as far as I know, although
they always have co-directed. Presumably before this they split the
directing and producing credits and shared writing credits out of
respect for Hollywood (and specifically DGA) convention. Now the
fraternal revolution they launched has swept them up - "If the
Farrellys can do it, if the Warchowskis can do it, so can we." This
film has a lot of Farrellyisms in it.
8713

From: tscogs
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:12pm
Subject: from The Guardian UK: "In brief: Bye bye to 'A film by...' "

http://film.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,12589,1176812,00.html
8714

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 6:05pm
Subject: Mackendrick paraphase about coincidence

Coincidence is just exposition in the wrong place.
8715

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:42pm
Subject: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

Following LES VAMPIRES, this will be the second DVD release of a
Feuillade serial in the US, and after FANTOMAS, the third worldwide.
I'm looking forward to seeing this, after thoroughly enjoying LES
VAMPIRES and hearing so much about JUDEX for so long.

http://www.flickeralley.com/pages/5/index.htm

-Jaime
8716

From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:41pm
Subject: Re: from The Guardian UK: "In brief: Bye bye to 'A film by...' "

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "tscogs"
wrote:
> http://film.guardian.co.uk/news/story/0,12589,1176812,00.html

So, as I read it, the legal departments of studios will need
auteurist consultants to tell them if a director has a recognizable
signature, hence the right to the "A Film By" credit. Let's all
freshen up our CV s and go for it!
8717

From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:50pm
Subject: Re: Mackendrick paraphase about coincidence

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth Anne Nolan"
wrote:
> Coincidence is just exposition in the wrong place.

I love Mackendrick - I haven't seen it in a while, but I have a
special fondness for Don't Make Waves, perhaps because I'm
fonder than I should be of 60s sex comedies. As I recall, Marty
Rubin showed it in the 60s SC series with which he brought his
programming tenure at the Huntington Hartford to an
emphatically contrarian climax, along with Man's..., Bachelor Flat
and the very, very great Love and Kisses.
8718

From: Jess Amortell
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 10:01pm
Subject: Boris Barnet footnote

For anyone who's seen ALENKA (ALYONKA)... Just came across this cartoon from the (Jan. 5) New Yorker: recalcitrant tyke who's inscribed "7 x 5 = 75" on the blackboard instructing the exasperated teacher, "It may be wrong, but it's how I feel." Is this the (much) shorter, sweeter, (I was going to say "cuter" but the Barnet episode does have its cutesy moments) version of the classroom episode in the film? I don't recall whether Alenka, the child in the film, ever "explains" her behavior -- if so, I doubt it's anywhere near so pointedly. (It's obviously not a total stretch to read Alenka's contrarian arithmetic as a reflection of Barnet's own somewhat unorthodox aesthetics, in which the parts aren't always toted up exactly as required.) Anyway, my only point really is that I couldn't help wondering if the artist had seen the film, e.g. last year at BAM -- even though the cartoon could probably have been inspired by a schoolroom visit anytime, anywhere.
8719

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 11:15pm
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

Is Franju's JUDEX available on DVD?

I think it's his masterpiece.

--- "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> Following LES VAMPIRES, this will be the second DVD
> release of a
> Feuillade serial in the US, and after FANTOMAS, the
> third worldwide.
> I'm looking forward to seeing this, after thoroughly
> enjoying LES
> VAMPIRES and hearing so much about JUDEX for so
> long.
>
> http://www.flickeralley.com/pages/5/index.htm
>
> -Jaime
>
>

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8720

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 11:17pm
Subject: Re: Boris Barnet footnote

> For anyone who's seen ALENKA (ALYONKA)... Just came across this
> cartoon from the (Jan. 5) New Yorker: recalcitrant tyke who's
> inscribed "7 x 5 = 75" on the blackboard instructing the exasperated
> teacher, "It may be wrong, but it's how I feel." Is this the (much)
> shorter, sweeter, (I was going to say "cuter" but the Barnet episode
> does have its cutesy moments) version of the classroom episode in the
> film? I don't recall whether Alenka, the child in the film, ever
> "explains" her behavior --

Alyonka's explanation comes early in the episode: she has bet her friend
an ice cream that she can get five bad marks in a row, despite her
status as star pupil.

What an excellent film this is. - Dan
8721

From:
Date: Wed Mar 31, 2004 7:04pm
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

This is wonderful news!
I too, loved Les Vampires. And have wanted to see Judex for decades. Have
never had a chance to see Franju's remake, either.
David Bordwell's next book will be 1/4 about Feuillade, doing an in-depth
look at the visual style of his films (according to Bordwell's web site). He has
seen far more than I have ever had the chance (Les Vampires + "Juve contre
Fantomas").
I've never even been sure how to pronounce "Judex".
Mike Grost
8722

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 0:53am
Subject: Re: Mackendrick paraphase about coincidence

> Coincidence is just exposition in the wrong place.

There's a similar Billy Wilder quote that goes something like: "Every
script contains a coincidence - just make sure that it happens at the
beginning of the story and not the end." - Dan
8723

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 0:57am
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

> Following LES VAMPIRES, this will be the second DVD release of a
> Feuillade serial in the US, and after FANTOMAS, the third worldwide.
> I'm looking forward to seeing this, after thoroughly enjoying LES
> VAMPIRES and hearing so much about JUDEX for so long.

I don't think Feuillade's JUDEX is nearly as good as LES VAMPIRES or
FANTOMAS, unfortunately. - Dan
8724

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 1:02am
Subject: Re: from The Guardian UK: "In brief: Bye bye to 'A film by...' "

I'd be happy to see the "A Film By" credit go away. It's always seemed
insensitive and grandiose to me.

But I really like the way Hawks changed "Produced and Directed by..." to
"Directed and Produced by Howard Hawks." - Dan
8725

From: Robert Keser
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 1:46am
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:

> I've never even been sure how to pronounce "Judex".
> Mike Grost

ZHYOO-decks, I believe.

Incidentally, the Paul Fejos Fantômas is fairly interesting,
but I haven't seen the Feuillade original, so I can't make any
comparisons, odious or otherwise.

--Robert Keser
8726

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:03am
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein wrote:
> Is Franju's JUDEX available on DVD?

Not yet, but it's *coming* to DVD, hence the title of the thread.

-Jaime
8727

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:07am
Subject: a film by

The trailer for the new Hugh Jackman movie VAN HELSING announces
itself as "a film by Stephen Sommers." I don't see many new movies
these days, but that might be the first time I'd heard it in a movie
ad following the creation of this group. Anyway, the first time it
registered.

It looks like it might be good. I'd rather see a reprisal of Peter
Fonda's Van Helsing, tho.

-Jaime
8728

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:09am
Subject: Re: Feuillade's JUDEX coming to DVD (correction)

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:
> > Is Franju's JUDEX available on DVD?
>
> Not yet, but it's *coming* to DVD, hence the title of the thread.
>
> -Jaime

Oops, it's late.

I've never seen Franju's version on video anywhere. The Donnell Media
Center branch of the New York Public Library has a 16mm print that's
available to the public. I've been meaning to check it out.

-Jaime
8729

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 8:12am
Subject: new horror

Saw the new DAWN OF THE DEAD this evening. Got the idea that Snyder
and screenwriter Gunn were more inspired by THE STAND than any Romero
zombie flick, hence the acute pessimism, the expanded cast of "good
guys," the psychos who become drunk with a little power, etc. Both
DOTD movies and THE STAND share a producer, Richard Rubinstein.

But these Zombies are stand-ins for the Iraqis (or Somalis?) - whereas
the original NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD ended with a thinly veiled
reference to the political turmoil of the time (My Lai, race riots,
violent aggression against southern blacks), only after Gulf Wars 1
and 2 could there be a movie in which a major scene features the
heroes, with clearly superior killing power and an overwhelming
strategic advantage (okay, so they can't go anywhere, yeah yeah yeah)
make sport of picking off the Enemy. Too bad the filmmaker doesn't
seem to care much for exploring or acknowledging this kind of
interpretation - which isn't exactly a stretch.

New horror films (like CABIN FEVER) disgust me - it isn't the gore, or
the special effects. These new films drool over mutilation, cruelty,
and (true-blue human) suffering, and these directors (Zack Snyder made
commercials) sell debasement like laundry detergent. It's horrifying
in the wrong sense, I feel.

-Jaime
8730

From: Henrik Sylow
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 9:02am
Subject: Re: new horror

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:

> But these Zombies are stand-ins for the Iraqis (or Somalis?) -
whereas
> the original NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD ended with a thinly veiled
> reference to the political turmoil of the time (My Lai, race riots,
> violent aggression against southern blacks), only after Gulf Wars 1
> and 2 could there be a movie in which a major scene features the
> heroes, with clearly superior killing power and an overwhelming
> strategic advantage (okay, so they can't go anywhere, yeah yeah
yeah)
> make sport of picking off the Enemy. Too bad the filmmaker doesn't
> seem to care much for exploring or acknowledging this kind of
> interpretation - which isn't exactly a stretch.

The original NoTLD has no political messege. In fact, when Romero
was asked if he wasnt afraid to give blacks a form of martyrdom,
when shooting the lead at the end, he shook his head and realised
that the reporters were reading all sorts of social issues into his
film, where none was intended, as NoTLD was nothing more than a
bunch of guys making a horror film.

Having said that, it is so easy to read a social context out of
science fiction (and related horror), as the genre is an extension
to the world we know. In the original Dawn, Romero decided to make a
little fun out of the reason why the zombies would roam the mall and
even return there and had his character say: "Why do they come
here?", and answer, "Because its their home." So while there is an
element of consumerism in Dawn, it never was intended as a distinct
social critic.

The generic horror director doesn't care about social context or
interpretation. As the genre still is the bastard of film, second
cousin to porn, few real directors venture here and fewer dare to
use its rules.

> New horror films (like CABIN FEVER) disgust me - it isn't the
gore, or
> the special effects. These new films drool over mutilation,
cruelty,
> and (true-blue human) suffering, and these directors (Zack Snyder
made
> commercials) sell debasement like laundry detergent. It's
horrifying
> in the wrong sense, I feel.

There is nothing wrong in mutilation or cruelty. It can be great
entertainment, if used the right way. Having said that, I also have
to add, that nothing disgusts me.

But I agree with you, that few films today are horror (as in "I want
to scare you") and more suffering (as in "I want to hurt you"). The
killer no longer wants just to kill you, he wants to get off on your
pain, and Im not talking about the victim: I sense its the director
who has turned into some sadistic freak wanting to make the audience
twiggle in pain, for no other reason that his own sake: The more you
hurt, the "better" director he is.

Henrik
8731

From: jaketwilson
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 9:14am
Subject: Re: new horror

Dawn of the Dead hasn't made it to Australia yet, but I just saw
Scooby Doo 2, which I also found repugnant – interesting that the
same screenwriter should be behind both. Recent Hollywood horror
movies are mainly dreadful, but hardly worse than most recent
Hollywood films for children. What I find most offensive in both
genres, and in today's Hollywood generally, isn't sadism so much as a
kind of smarmy refusal to show feeling -- most often expressed
through unfunny one-liners that are "screenwriting" in the worst
sense, signalling the filmmakers' superiority to a narrative which
neither they nor the audience are expected to believe in. In a film
like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre remake, images of human beings
getting chopped up, crucified and so forth are presented
affectlessly, as if by contractual obligation, without any sign of
either empathy or sadistic glee. Films which show more personal
investment in sadism (say, the Jeepers Creepers series) I find
preferable in a way – at least the director cares about the material!
I go back and forth when thinking about the ethical issues relating
to horror generally. It's surely true that all horror films exploit
the human fascination with evil and cruelty, and this is legitimate
terrain for art to explore; it's hard to say what moral compass tells
us when the "disagreeables evaporate", as Keats said of King Lear,
and when they don't. In any case horror which truly works on us has
to make us aware of our own less palatable drives. I've never been
convinced by the argument that says horror films ought to be
consciously underwritten by "socially significant" metaphors – it
seems to me that genuinely frightening images have to come from the
filmmaker's unconscious and are bound to be underwritten by all kinds
of political, sexual, social meanings whether these are "intended" or
not.

JTW
8732

From: Jess Amortell
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 0:39pm
Subject: Re: Boris Barnet footnote

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Dan Sallitt wrote:
>
> Alyonka's explanation comes early in the episode: she has bet her friend
> an ice cream that she can get five bad marks in a row, despite her
> status as star pupil.
>
> What an excellent film this is. - Dan

Ah, that does explain, and renders more delicious, the episode's practically erotic ice-cream finale -- I guess I missed the premise when I went out for ice cream or something. I know it's unrealistic to expect yet a third (brief) go-round of these films (at a theater uncompromised by projection problems or auditory annoyances) but then again, he seems to have made plenty more as yet unshown -- do these "exist"?

As a sidenote, I enjoyed the way ALENKA's "Lady with the Little Dog" episode seemed to refer directly and delightfully not just to the short story, but to the presumably well-known Heifetz film, made, according to the IMDb, just the year before. (Do we know whether Barnet's films, by that point, had any popularity of their own?)
8733

From: Gary W. Tooze
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 0:54pm
Subject: 'Where is the Friends Home' now on DVD with Kiarostami commentary...

http://207.136.67.23/film/DVDReview2/whereisthefriendshome.htm

Gary William Tooze
http://www.DVDBeaver.com
8734

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 3:27pm
Subject: Re: new horror

> The original NoTLD has no political messege. In fact, when Romero
> was asked if he wasnt afraid to give blacks a form of martyrdom,
> when shooting the lead at the end, he shook his head and realised
> that the reporters were reading all sorts of social issues into his
> film, where none was intended, as NoTLD was nothing more than a
> bunch of guys making a horror film.

Intentions count for very little, I think. You might extend those
reporters a little credit, rather than implying that the director has
closed the door on far out interpretations (as if a social/political
reading is, by virtue of being social/political, far out) because of
what he "intended."

> Having said that, it is so easy to read a social context out of
> science fiction (and related horror), as the genre is an extension
> to the world we know. In the original Dawn, Romero decided to make
a
> little fun out of the reason why the zombies would roam the mall
and
> even return there and had his character say: "Why do they come
> here?", and answer, "Because its their home." So while there is an
> element of consumerism in Dawn, it never was intended as a distinct
> social critic.

I don't understand the last part.

> The generic horror director doesn't care about social context or
> interpretation. As the genre still is the bastard of film, second
> cousin to porn, few real directors venture here and fewer dare to
> use its rules.

I don't trust these blanket statements.

> But I agree with you, that few films today are horror (as in "I
want
> to scare you") and more suffering (as in "I want to hurt you"). The
> killer no longer wants just to kill you, he wants to get off on
your
> pain, and Im not talking about the victim: I sense its the director
> who has turned into some sadistic freak wanting to make the
audience
> twiggle in pain, for no other reason that his own sake: The more
you
> hurt, the "better" director he is.

Sometimes this bothers me and sometimes it doesn't - I guess what
counts is whether the film is good enough that it isn't merely a big,
unpleasant viewing experience with nothing else going for it.

-Jaime
8735

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 3:28pm
Subject: Re: new horror /old horror NIGHT OF THE DEMON

Separate from the gore, sadism, etc, there seems to be no possibility
that a selected victim might escape in some of today's horror films.

I watched Tourneur's NIGHT OF THE DEMON yesterday. It is so clear
that the horror is in the psychological fear of what MIGHT happen,
especially as the meeting with death is PREVENTABLE by passing on
the runic papers.

Especially entertaining is when Dr. Holden realizes he must get rid
of the runic paper and wants to pass it on to the anxious Karswell.
Except for the emergence of the demon from the smoke of the train, I
could have stopped viewing when I know Karswell knows he's gotten
stuck with the runic papers.
8736

From: pkael
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 3:29pm
Subject: Re: LADYKILLERS

I don't think it's a bad movie because of a failure to capture the original's character -- God
forbid the Coens should try out their ersatz British-isms -- so much as its failure to
establish any character of its own. Like O BROTHER, it's a scattershot movie held together
by a wonderful soundtrack and not much else. It's sloppy enough to have prompted a
reconsideration on my part of all of the Coens' recent movies, which with the exception of
the wonderful INTOLERABLE CRUELTY (which they wrote as work-for-hire) seems to
represent an increasing sloppiness and lack of inspiration from BIG LEBOWSKI on down.
There's a smugness and lack of attention in the new movie that borders on contemptible.

Sam (first post!)

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth Anne Nolan" wrote:
> I found no archived posts for LADYKILLERS and don't recall any.
>
> The original LADYKILLERS is delightful; not so, the COENS' recent
> effort.
>
> Rosenbaum's LADYKILLERS (both original and recent) review
> [snip]
>> is well worth reading regarding the recent posts of lack of
> originality, not because of the "remake," but because of the remake's
> failure to capture the essence of the original, the "BRITISH"
> character.
8737

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 3:34pm
Subject: Re: 'Where is the Friends Home' now on DVD with Kiarostami commentary...

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Gary W. Tooze" wrote:
>
> http://207.136.67.23/film/DVDReview2/whereisthefriendshome.htm
>
>
> Gary William Tooze
> http://www.DVDBeaver.com

This is a wonderful film. And being a considerably more
narrative-centric than Kiarostami's later films, I would recommend it
as the perfect introduction to his cinema for people who haven't had
much exposure to non-Hollywood cinema and might be scared off by TASTE
OF CHERRY and the others.

-Jaime
8738

From: pkael
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 3:41pm
Subject: Re: new horror

If memory serves, Romero contradicts this (and possibly himself) in his commentary on the
new DAWN DVD, copping to at least a general intention to satirize American lock-step
consumerism. NIGHT is one of those movies, like the original INVASION OF THE BODY
SNATCHERS, that so effectively embodies a primal fear that it can be seen (and has been)
as a metaphor for almost anything.

Good point about the difference between "horror" and "suffering" movies. I've just
rewatched the original TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE since Tobe Hooper will be in
Philadelphia as part of our upcoming film festival (come one, come all) and it's shocking
how genuinely *horrifying* it is, especially since the movie's appreciation has slipped into
camp over the years. I think CHAINSAW is actually more sadistic than most modern horror
(I haven't been able to bring myself to watch the remake) but it's certainly no more
appalling than the acts it depicts. The prevalence of commercial/music video directors
assigned to modern-day horror movies, with their artfully edge-lit shots of buxom women
waiting to be slaughtered, would seem to put us back in "tracking shot in KAPO" territory.

Sam

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Henrik Sylow" wrote:
> Having said that, it is so easy to read a social context out of
> science fiction (and related horror), as the genre is an extension
> to the world we know. In the original Dawn, Romero decided to make a
> little fun out of the reason why the zombies would roam the mall and
> even return there and had his character say: "Why do they come
> here?", and answer, "Because its their home." So while there is an
> element of consumerism in Dawn, it never was intended as a distinct
> social critic.

[snip]

> But I agree with you, that few films today are horror (as in "I want
> to scare you") and more suffering (as in "I want to hurt you"). The
> killer no longer wants just to kill you, he wants to get off on your
> pain, and Im not talking about the victim: I sense its the director
> who has turned into some sadistic freak wanting to make the audience
> twiggle in pain, for no other reason that his own sake: The more you
> hurt, the "better" director he is.
>
> Henrik
8739

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 4:11pm
Subject: Re: new horror

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "pkael" wrote:
> If memory serves, Romero contradicts this (and possibly himself) in
his commentary on the
> new DAWN DVD, copping to at least a general intention to satirize
American lock-step
> consumerism. NIGHT is one of those movies, like the original
INVASION OF THE BODY
> SNATCHERS, that so effectively embodies a primal fear that it can be
seen (and has been)
> as a metaphor for almost anything.

On the whole I think that may be true, but the final scene in NIGHT is
definitely "of its time": in tone and given its lack of identifiable
faces it sets itself apart from the rest of the movie. And isn't the
zombie plague a "popular uprising" of a perverse sort, that must be
put down by the gun-wielding populace? The lasting impression I have
from two viewings, of the final scene, is of a bunch of rednecks,
piles of burning bodies, and the black guy being shot.

On the other hand, every film is "of its time," so I think it's
worthwhile to examine each film in the context of what was happening
in the world when it was made and released. This is where a
filmmaker's "intention" tends to relinquish its authority.

-Jaime
8740

From:
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 4:44pm
Subject: re: horror films

Oh, agreed, absolutely. I just think Romero's not a good example of
an accidental social reflector since he's sporadically admitted his
intention to do just that over the years. (And denied it at least as
often, out of modesty or sheer contrariness.) TX Chainsaw's
reflection of Watergate-era dissolution and distrust, on the other
hand, seems almost entirely unconscious, and is the more powerful for
it.

Sam

>--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
> wrote:
>
>> On the other hand, every film is "of its time," so I think it's
>> worthwhile to examine each film in the context of what was happening
>> in the world when it was made and released. This is where a
>> filmmaker's "intention" tends to relinquish its authority.
>>
>> -Jaime
8741

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 5:04pm
Subject: Re: Re: Boris Barnet footnote

>> Alyonka's explanation comes early in the episode: she has bet her
>> friend an ice cream that she can get five bad marks in a row,
>> despite her status as star pupil.
>
> Ah, that does explain, and renders more delicious, the episode's
> practically erotic ice-cream finale -- I guess I missed the premise
> when I went out for ice cream or something.

The other bit of information Alyonka gives us is that her parents won't
let her eat ice cream because of some problem with "her glands." She
simply sees this as an obstacle to be overcome, of course.

The subtle limitations to Alyonka's personality - she doesn't even
figure her teachers' and parents' distress into the ice cream equation -
makes this flashback match the others: the bad-luck/good-luck dentist
who imparts a heroic cast to her fumbling adventures in the steppes; the
worker who perceives his wife's unhappiness but simply can't understand
that he is causing it. ALYONKA is a sweet synthesis of colliding
artistic elements: the beautiful compositions on the truck ride, always
featuring the sky meeting the steppes at infinity; the way that the
editing adopts the eccentric rhythms of the flashback storytellers; and
the understated way that the comedy points up the limitations of
sensibility of all the storytellers, while maintaining a gentle
affection for them.

> but then
> again, he seems to have made plenty more as yet unshown -- do these
> "exist"?

Many of them do. The selection for this series was good, but not by any
means exhaustive. My guess is that THE WRESTLER AND THE CLOWN and
WHISTLE STOP are the ones we most want to see now; Maxime confirms this
in an earlier A_Film_By post, and also points us toward THE OLD JOCKEY,
MISS MEND, and MEN OF NOVGOROD.

Thanks to the vigorous efforts of Bilge Ebiri, I have unsubtitled VHS
copies of WRESTLER, WHISTLE STOP, and THE SCOUT'S EXPLOIT, with synopses
from our friend Vadim Rizov. I haven't tried to see these yet, but I
think a communal screening helps when you have to piece together
untranslated meaning. So any interested New Yorkers can let me know if
they'd like to be invited when I get around to showing these at home.

> (Do we know whether
> Barnet's films, by that point, had any popularity of their own?)

I get the feeling that the early comedies were successful; and so was
THE SCOUT'S EXPLOIT, which auteurist types seem to agree is not one of
Barnet's most personal works. The later films, which auteurists have
praised the most, were apparently generally considered artistic
failures, and I don't think they burned up the box office either. (In
fact, Barnet's suicide note said that he'd lost the ability to make good
films, and with it his desire to live. But his last two films were
ALYONKA and WHISTLE STOP! Hope his death wasn't a tragic mistake
brought on by an oblivious film culture. Probably not, actually: his
last written words to his daughter were something like, "I've only
barely been able to hang on until today," which suggests to me a serious
case of depression.) Barnet's films were often banned by the
authorities, and he was considered a declined artist at the end, but he
seemed to enjoy some fame and reputation in Russia. - Dan
8742

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 5:31pm
Subject: Re: Re: new horror

> What I find most offensive in both
> genres, and in today's Hollywood generally, isn't sadism so much as a
> kind of smarmy refusal to show feeling -- most often expressed
> through unfunny one-liners that are "screenwriting" in the worst
> sense, signalling the filmmakers' superiority to a narrative which
> neither they nor the audience are expected to believe in. In a film
> like the Texas Chainsaw Massacre remake, images of human beings
> getting chopped up, crucified and so forth are presented
> affectlessly, as if by contractual obligation, without any sign of
> either empathy or sadistic glee.

Bad commercial filmmaking shows a very strong tendency to override the
characters' story-determined feelings and reactions, and to replace them
with the presumed level of feeling/reaction of the audience at that
point in the viewing experience. (For instance, this explains why the
best friend who dies at the beginning of so many adventure films goes
pretty much unmourned by the protagonist, why the sidekick who dies at
the end of the second act gets a modest, delimited-in-time mourning
period, and why real mourning within the film universe is generally
reserved for the death of identification figures.)

It sort of makes sense that current horror films would reflect the
decreased sensitivity of audiences toward violence, and that so many
horror films are predicated, SCREAM-style, on the idea of a reflexive
game/joke.

Compare and contrast the remarkable original TEXAS CHAINSAW MASSACRE.

(SPOILER coming!)

By conventional rules, the audience should be given relief when the
heroine escapes; but she is unrecognizably bloody, demented, and
screaming in the last shot, despite having gotten away. Her totally
plausible dehumanization and trauma are a challenge to the audience, who
are reaching for their coats and probably want closure. - Dan
8743

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 5:40pm
Subject: Re: LADYKILLERS

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "pkael"
wrote:
Like O BROTHER, it's a scattershot movie held together
> by a wonderful soundtrack and not much else.

Sam, welcome to a_film_by. I will be in the minority on this one
(see my review, also posted), but I like the film apart from the
dreadful writing, which can't be a paramount consideration for
me as an auteurist (even if they did it themselves!).

Also, again putting me in the minority, I think the soundtrack is
deliberately irritating and probably won't make it onto the charts -
it's a satirical use of gospel, and a recoiling from the unplanned
success of the O Brother soundtrack (which isn't THAT great - I
bought it and listened while writing my Ladykillers review, and it's
got maybe 4 great tracks, mostly by the people in the movie).

Fortunately my Economist reviews don't leave much scope for
me to be semiotic, because I'm still trying to figure what I liked
about Ladykillers, and what it means. I will definitely watch
Intolerable Cruelty now on your recommendation. Maybe it's the
bridge from their spotty middle period (Fargo being the last - and
first in some time - that I really cared for before O Brother) and
what promises to be an interesting late period, during which
(small sign) they are finally co-signing the mise-en-scene.

For the record, and I have said this before, I don't care if a
filmmaker likes his/her characters (who don't even exist!), or is
him/herself a Good Person. This also puts me in the minority
among auteurists, but I've been strange all my life, so I'm not
crushed by my position as odd man out on these things.
8744

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:04pm
Subject: Re: LADYKILLERS

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "pkael" wrote:
> I don't think it's a bad movie because of a failure to capture the
original's character -- God forbid the Coens should try out their
ersatz British-isms -- so much as its failure to establish any character
of its own.

Agreed. Of course, there is no BRITISH character in the USA; if they
wanted to create an essence for the USA character today, it would have
been one of victimology in context of civil law suits!
8745

From: Greg Dunlap
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:07pm
Subject: Re: 'Where is the Friends Home' now on DVD with Kiarostami commentary...

This may sound like a stupid question, but is this commentary in
English? I was under the impression that Kiarostami didn't really speak
much English, all the interviews I've seen with him he used
translators.

I agree with Jaime that this is a wonderful and moving film. It is
probably my third favorite Kiarostami (after Close Up and Taste Of
Cherry.)

Along these same lines, does anyone know if it is possible to get a
video copy of Through The Olive Treees in the proper aspect ratio? I've
seen some PAL tapes for sale here and there, but I get the impression
they are cropped.

=====
--------------------
Greg Dunlap
heyrocker@y...

8746

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:17pm
Subject: Re: new horror

> But these Zombies are stand-ins for the Iraqis (or Somalis?) -
whereas
> the original NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD ended with a thinly
veiled
> reference to the political turmoil of the time (My Lai, race riots,
> violent aggression against southern blacks), only after Gulf
Wars 1
> and 2 could there be a movie in which a major scene features
the
> heroes, with clearly superior killing power and an
overwhelming
> strategic advantage (okay, so they can't go anywhere, yeah
yeah yeah)
> make sport of picking off the Enemy.

Hey, it's getting so Americans can't go anywhere in Iraq!

IMO the "zombies are blacks" end credits in the first Night are a
retrospective attempt by Romero to interpret a film made
instinctively. The interpretation is literally tacked on, as has been
noted before (by Serge Daney, among others). And I believe that
this is one of several retrospective interpretations Romero
himself proposes throughout the trilogy (including the unmade
epic version of Day) for the first film, which erupted out of his and
the other makers' unconscious minds without any clear meaning
being attached to it . Literally, the trilogy IS this process of finding
meaning in a meaningless phenomenon (consumerism etc.) I
detailed that process in "13 Ways of Looking at a Zombie,"
written for Torino.

One meaning that's sure foregrounded in the new Dawn is
religious - hence the use of the apocalyptic Cash tune in the
opening credits. But in this film the END credits pretty much
erase all meaning.

8747

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:31pm
Subject: Re: new horror /old horror NIGHT OF THE DEMON

>
> Especially entertaining is when Dr. Holden realizes he must
get rid
> of the runic paper and wants to pass it on to the anxious
Karswell.
> Except for the emergence of the demon from the smoke of the
train, I
> could have stopped viewing when I know Karswell knows he's
gotten
> stuck with the runic papers.

Tourneur didn't want to show Karswell in the demon's grip,
although his death would have been enacted off camera. The
demon was added by the studio.
8748

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:33pm
Subject: Re: new horror

I agree w. Dan that horror movies just refelect current narrative
trends.
>
> Compare and contrast the remarkable original TEXAS
CHAINSAW MASSACRE.

I just saw it for the first time, and it's a masterpiece. But I'm
curious - the same genius dp shot the remake, which I haven't
seen. Does that show?
8749

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 6:29pm
Subject: Re: new horror

>
> > But I agree with you, that few films today are horror (as in "I
> want
> > to scare you") and more suffering (as in "I want to hurt you").
The
> > killer no longer wants just to kill you, he wants to get off on
> your
> > pain, and Im not talking about the victim: I sense its the
director
> > who has turned into some sadistic freak wanting to make the
> audience
> > twiggle in pain, for no other reason that his own sake: The
more
> you
> > hurt, the "better" director he is.
>
> Sometimes this bothers me and sometimes it doesn't - I
guess what
> counts is whether the film is good enough that it isn't merely a
big,
> unpleasant viewing experience with nothing else going for it.

I have said what I had to say about meaning/non-meaning in
Night (see my post).

The sadism Henrik attributes to modern horror is true of modern
cinema in general. In the old days it was enough for the hero to
be disgraced and go to jail if he is wrongly convicted of a crime.
Now he has to be in danger of going to a hellish prison where
his worst enemy is the warden, while his wife will be sleeping
with the real criminal and his children will be thrown out to beg
for their bread on the streets of Juno, Alaska, where they will
become child prostitutes...

The most ridiculous example of "upping the ante'" is Minority
Report, where Cruise will be condemned to an eternity of living
(conscious) death for a crime he didn't commit (even though he
does finally commit it...the punishment would have been the
same if he hadn't). In the original story there was no punishment
mechanism - much less one as monstrously sadistic as the
writers came up with for the film!
8750

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 7:09pm
Subject: Re: new horror /old horror NIGHT OF THE DEMON

I read Tourneur did not want the demon to appear so early
in the film. I thought the smoke image from which the demon
appears quite an effect, even today; it must have been something
at the time. Interesting that the smoke image (sans demon)
appears again when Holden is leaving Karswell's ... the image
itself is frightening enough (for the audience at this point).

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666" wrote:
> Tourneur didn't want to show Karswell in the demon's grip,
> although his death would have been enacted off camera. The
> demon was added by the studio.
8751

From: Joseph Kaufman
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 7:23pm
Subject: Re: new horror

Bill wrote:

>One meaning that's sure foregrounded in the new Dawn is
>religious - hence the use of the apocalyptic Cash tune in the
>opening credits. But in this film the END credits pretty much
>erase all meaning.

Worth noting that the end credits scenes were a last-minute reshoot.
However there's some kind of precedent. A script I saw for Romero's
DAWN had the helicopter lifting off at the end, then exploding. He
obviously thought better of filming it that way.
--

- Joe Kaufman
8752

From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 9:08pm
Subject: Re: new horror

-
> DAWN had the helicopter lifting off at the end, then exploding.
He
> obviously thought better of filming it that way.
> --
>
> - Joe Kaufman

My script has the black guy getting devoured before the Last
Girl's eyes and her committing suicide by stricking her head up
into the whirling blades.

Interesting that the excellent end-credits of the new one were a
reshoot. Details? Source?
8753

From: Henrik Sylow
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 11:53pm
Subject: Re: new horror

It is curious, that while American horror maintained the teen
wholesome heroine, Asian horror developed the single mother into
Horror.

Note films like Dark Waters, The Ring and JuOn (even in semi horror
as Inugami) for instant: the heroine is a single divorce (widow)
mother, struggling to be both mother and professional.

I has struk me on a previous occasion, but I never thought much
about it, until now, where it struck me again, as we are talking
about horror.

Where the American heroine is able to withstand and ultimately
overcome the terror because of her wholesomeness (her virginity),
the Asian heroine doesn't overcome, but becomes a victim. Her
stuggling to preserve is in vain. So why is modern Asian horror so
bleak and without resolution? Does it tell us, that unless we are
good parents and take care of our children, we are doomed to lose
them?

If so, can the themes of Asian horror be read as warnings: Don't let
your kids watch TV alone and without supervision (Ringu), Don't let
your kids wait alone or walk home alone, always pick them up (Dark
Waters), Never let your kids play alone (JuOn)?

Henrik
8754

From: jpcoursodon
Date: Thu Apr 1, 2004 11:38pm
Subject: Re: THE LADYKILLERS

I shall review the film for a French film magazine that worships the
Coens, so I'll probably tone down my objections a bit, but I really
liked it in spite of its shortcomings (sloppiness -- the film is
awfully constructed and all over the place -- and bad taste we're
supposed to find hilarious because the brothers are so cool they
are "above" bad taste; I may be old-fashioned but I could do without
the irritable bowels or the fingers up the hood's nostrils). But
there are so many wonderful things along the way that it's hard not
to go along and forget the dross... What about that great high angle
shot during the credits, with the garbage barge slowly sailing under
the bridge and the raven that comes to perch on the gargoyle? The
entire film is encapsulated there and it's just elegant...

I don't agree with BK that Hanks is not funny. I thought he was very
funny,simpering mannerisms and phony, high-falutin speech included.
The fact that no one understands a word of what he is saying is fun
too. I like the way the old black lady responds to words like Ph.D.
or Sorbonne (it makes her think of her sore bones...)And J.K. Simmons
is great too -- a cartoon character (they're all cartoon characters,
of course) with a human quality in the way he acknowledges and
accepts his own ineptitude without ever losing his faith in his
competency.

Sure, it's minor Coens, like most of their post-Fargo films, but way
above most of what passes for comedy these days.

JPC
8755

From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 0:16am
Subject: Re: THE LADYKILLERS

> the irritable bowels

Maybe because I work in health care publications I'm a sucker
for those jokes (not the sudden bowel urges - the rest of it), but
the way diseases have now become like oppressed minorities
with their own support groups (Irritable Bowel Singles) and
consciousness-raising challenges ("2 million Americans have it
and most of us don't KNOW we have it") makes this brilliant
satire. This guy started out as a freedom rider; now his bowels
are his "cause."

On the other hand, Mrs. Munson hearing PhD as "Fudd" is just
horrible.
8756

From: Richard Modiano
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 0:32am
Subject: Re: new horror /old horror NIGHT OF THE DEMON

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Elizabeth Anne Nolan"
wrote:
"I read Tourneur did not want the demon to appear so early
in the film."

In an interview with Joel Siegel Tourmeur said, "I wanted, at the
very end, when the train goes by, to include only four frames of the
monster coming up with the guy and throwing him down. Boom, boom--did
I see it or didn't I?"

The production history of NIGHT OF THE DEMON is discussed by Chris
Fujiwara in his excellent book on Tourneur "The Cinema of Nightfall."

Richard
8757

From: Joseph Kaufman
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 0:42am
Subject: Re: new horror

>Interesting that the excellent end-credits of the new one were a
>reshoot. Details? Source?

Sorry I can't help historicity by giving you details where I heard
about the end sequence for the new film. Read it in the newspaper
somewhere, I think.

In any event, a bleak finale seems to have been something that Romero
seriously considered for the original, based on your own script copy.

Where do writers for THE ECONOMIST get credit, or is it all
anonymous? At least the Cinefile newsletter gives you "agent" status.
--

- Joe Kaufman
8758

From: jaketwilson
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 1:31am
Subject: Re: new horror

Dan Sallitt wrote:

> It sort of makes sense that current horror films would reflect the
> decreased sensitivity of audiences toward violence, and that so
many horror films are predicated, SCREAM-style, on the idea of a >
> reflexive game/joke.

It's years since I've seen it, but I liked the first SCREAM: all that
reflexive stuff seemed to be used purposefully to make a statement
about the way we watch genre movies generally, seesawing between
suspension of disbelief (revulsion at scenes of torture and murder)
and its opposite (it's all just harmless, unreal fun). The sequels
and most of the imitations come down clearly on the side of
burlesque, and the tension falls away. Signalling that the narrative
is a joke seems particularly self-defeating in this context because
more than most genres, horror depends on drawing the audience into
the fictional world. That's taking for granted horror films are meant
to be scary, which I suppose some people, even fans, would dispute.

JTW
8759

From: Adrian Martin
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 2:07am
Subject: Modern horror and world cinema

"Does it tell us, that unless we are
good parents and take care of our children, we are doomed to lose
them?"

Henrik - I think you are on to something here. But I don't think it's just
on the level of 'don't let your kids watch TV' or stuff like that. What is
so striking about RING - and so glaringly absent from the American remake,
in my view - is that the central, underlying 'horror' of the story comes
from the fact that its an indirect commentary on the NEGLECT of children by
their parents - and especially the phenomenon of the 'broken home' and how
this impacts on kids. It fascinates me that this is a far more 'everyday'
kind of horror (and of course the RING films are especially great on keying
into everyday iconography: phones, TV sets, etc) than the more
Gothic/melodramatic form we tend to find in American cinema and elsewhere,
where it's more a question of ABUSE (violent and/or sexual) of children by
parents, adults, authority figures.

Actually, to be frank, I find almost all recent English-language horror
movies (not just American but also Australian - UNDEAD - and British - 28
DAYS LATER) to be sadly devoid of metaphor of ANY kind. There is, to my way
of thinking, an absolutely nerdy, no-brainer approach to the horror genre
which has become awfully prevalent - that the genre is only about FEAR,
'fear of the dark', 'night terrors', all that nonsense - but these fears
almost never excavate anything bigger or juicier anymore: where are all the
contemporary horror movies about socio-political terrors, we have no
shortage of such topics in the world today!! I am frankly nostalgic for the
Romero era, and the better years of Carpenter, Craven, etc. I don't mind
whether Romero 'intended' his allegories/metaphors or not: they arose,
consciously or unconsciously, and then he worked with them (as Bill
suggested). Most contemporary horror films (much Asian horror excepted)
REPRESS all these possibilities very efficiently. I suspect Wes Craven,
unfortunately, helped to bring about this sea change, around the time of
that godawful, self-conscious, sanctimonious WES CRAVEN'S NEW NIGHTMARE:
that's when a very reduced kind of 'Jungian' view of nightmare, fear,
terror, etc, trampled all over the unconscious-social-reflection school!

Bill: where can we read your Torino essay on zombies?

Adrian
8760

From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 2:41am
Subject: Joel E. Siegel

> In an interview with Joel Siegel Tourmeur said, "I wanted, at the
> very end, when the train goes by, to include only four frames of the
> monster coming up with the guy and throwing him down. Boom, boom--did
> I see it or didn't I?"

By the way, Joel Siegel died recently - I think it was meningitis, and
rather sudden. - Dan
8761

From: jaketwilson
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 3:25am
Subject: Re: Modern horror and world cinema

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Adrian Martin wrote:

> Actually, to be frank, I find almost all recent English-language
horror movies (not just American but also Australian - UNDEAD - and
British - 28 DAYS LATER) to be sadly devoid of metaphor of ANY kind.
There is, to my way of thinking, an absolutely nerdy, no-brainer
approach to the horror genre which has become awfully prevalent -
> that the genre is only about FEAR, 'fear of the dark', 'night
terrors', all that nonsense - but these fears almost never excavate
anything bigger or juicier anymore: where are all the contemporary
horror movies about socio-political terrors, we have no shortage of
> such topics in the world today!!

But it's obviously not useful for a filmmaker in any genre to start
thinking: What major sociopolitical issues can I address in my next
movie? This is one of many cases where the wrong kind of knowingness
actually blocks the imagination from working –- the TV school of
horror-comedy typified by BUFFY and ANGEL is extremely self-conscious
about metaphor, and quite concerned with "identity politics", etc,
but I'm not sure how much that helps.

JTW
8762

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 3:59am
Subject: hit-and-run ETERNAL SUNSHINE remark

This I also saw yesterday, and the first thing that occurred to me
after finishing my brief report on filmwritten.org was this: that
ETERNAL SUNSHINE is the FIGHT CLUB that I've been waiting for,
significantly more satisfying as a studio-derived experimental film
and far more dazzling as a box of tricks. (Although I like FC quite a
bit.)

I'm beginning to key in on the level of humanity in the films I see,
and while the kind of "hipster misanthropy" doesn't necessarily kill a
movie for me one hundred percent of the time, it often does, and a
little compassion/insight goes a long way. ETERNAL SUNSHINE has quite
a bit.

-Jaime
8763

From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 5:07am
Subject: The Last Ang Lee Men?

http://news.yahoo.com/news?
tmpl=story&cid=598&u=/nm/20040331/film_nm/film_brokeback_dc&printer=1

As previously reported, this was a Gus Van Sant project - he
commissioned McMurtry to write it.
8764

From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 5:08am
Subject: The Last Ang Lee Men?

http://news.yahoo.com/news?
tmpl=story&cid=598&u=/nm/20040331/film_nm/film_brokeback_dc&printer=1

As previously reported, this was a Gus Van Sant project - he
commissioned McMurtry to write it.
8765

From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 5:09am
Subject: Re: new horror

> Where do writers for THE ECONOMIST get credit, or is it all
> anonymous? At least the Cinefile newsletter gives you "agent"
status.
> --
>
We don't get credit. But we are handsomely paid.
8766

From: Elizabeth Anne Nolan
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 6:17am
Subject: Re: Modern horror and world cinema

I agree with your reference to the 'psychological trauma of neglect'
but I think many families are well over that today: children have
much too many distractions to feel overt neglect; and children
actually run many families, feeling themselves the focus of the
family sphere, however artificial it may be. It may be that the
surrendering of parental guidance is the greatest form of
neglect, and as such, not readily recognized.

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Adrian Martin wrote:
> "Does it tell us, that unless we are
> good parents and take care of our children, we are doomed to lose
> them?"
>
> Henrik - I think you are on to something here. But I don't think
it's just
> on the level of 'don't let your kids watch TV' or stuff like that.
What is
> so striking about RING - and so glaringly absent from the American
remake,
> in my view - is that the central, underlying 'horror' of the story
comes
> from the fact that its an indirect commentary on the NEGLECT of
children by
> their parents - and especially the phenomenon of the 'broken home'
and how
> this impacts on kids. It fascinates me that this is a far more
'everyday'
> kind of horror (and of course the RING films are especially great
on keying
> into everyday iconography: phones, TV sets, etc) than the more
> Gothic/melodramatic form we tend to find in American cinema and
elsewhere,
> where it's more a question of ABUSE (violent and/or sexual) of
children by
> parents, adults, authority figures.
>
8767

From: samfilms2003
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 3:10pm
Subject: Re: Modern horror and world cinema

> (much Asian horror excepted)

And Adrian, I think you are on to something as well.

I've had a difficult time trying to explain why I like the Oxide Bros
"The Eye" as much as I do despite 'analytical' reasons not to.
(it turns into "US" horror at the end I think, "based on real-life story"
or not).

-Sam
8768

From: Kevin Lee
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 5:09pm
Subject: Re: hit-and-run ETERNAL SUNSHINE remark

I didn't realize your site was back up, that's terrific. I love the
click down detail windows that you and acquarello devised, it adds a
bit of suspense to reading your capsules (where did he see it? what
did he think? oh crap he didn't write anything, I'll just have to
settle for the star rating)

I also checked Jeremy Heilman's site and saw he was less enthusiastic
about this as you or me. I haven't read many reviews of this film
but I have to hand it to him for pointing out how "lopsided" this
relationship is (though your reference to FIGHT CLUB touches on this
too). But instead of dismissing Kate Winslet's character as a
cardboard prop for the female Other, I think Kaufman's projection of
Winslet takes on a life of its own, largely due to Winslet's game
performance. Somehow it avoids the imminent pitfall of male
narcissism, always evident in Kaufman's scripts (despite his self-
deprecating ways of making it palatable), with more success than
MALKOVICH or ADAPTATION. At any rate I prefer it to how Almodovar
objectified his women characters in TALK TO HER.

Kevin

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> This I also saw yesterday, and the first thing that occurred to me
> after finishing my brief report on filmwritten.org was this: that
> ETERNAL SUNSHINE is the FIGHT CLUB that I've been waiting for,
> significantly more satisfying as a studio-derived experimental film
> and far more dazzling as a box of tricks. (Although I like FC
quite a
> bit.)

>
> -Jaime
8769

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 5:57pm
Subject: Re: hit-and-run ETERNAL SUNSHINE remark

I was actually at peace with the nature of Kate Winslet's character, it's very logical that she
should act the way she does, on account of The Plot and stuff. Jeremy got this too, but he
said, "but still..." So to me she was like hypothetically, or comfortably, abrasive, and to
Jeremy she was overly abrasive, like she *really* bugged him. Plus I've known girls like
that, though, dated some even (sheesh), so I can relate and it took me a lot further, rather
than puting me off. I even found her likable and sweet some of the time. She's very
realistic.

But so but the thing is, in her own way, Clementine is going through a lot of the same stuff
as Joel, except we go all the way with Joel, see the whole process, *in progress*, and with
Clementine it's all exteriors, just a matter of watching her. Plus Gondry/Kaufman don't
spend as much time with the "real" her as with the "mental" her, they kind of get to her
when they get the chance, etc. Which is smart, perhaps - if the film spent more time on
her it might have suffered from overload, and it's just right as it is. In my opinion.

later
Jaime

p.s. When I leave comments I say "comments," so there shouldn't be any suspense. (I
hope!)

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Kevin Lee" wrote:
> I didn't realize your site was back up, that's terrific. I love the
> click down detail windows that you and acquarello devised, it adds a
> bit of suspense to reading your capsules (where did he see it? what
> did he think? oh crap he didn't write anything, I'll just have to
> settle for the star rating)
>
> I also checked Jeremy Heilman's site and saw he was less enthusiastic
> about this as you or me. I haven't read many reviews of this film
> but I have to hand it to him for pointing out how "lopsided" this
> relationship is (though your reference to FIGHT CLUB touches on this
> too). But instead of dismissing Kate Winslet's character as a
> cardboard prop for the female Other, I think Kaufman's projection of
> Winslet takes on a life of its own, largely due to Winslet's game
> performance. Somehow it avoids the imminent pitfall of male
> narcissism, always evident in Kaufman's scripts (despite his self-
> deprecating ways of making it palatable), with more success than
> MALKOVICH or ADAPTATION. At any rate I prefer it to how Almodovar
> objectified his women characters in TALK TO HER.
>
> Kevin
>
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
> wrote:
> > This I also saw yesterday, and the first thing that occurred to me
> > after finishing my brief report on filmwritten.org was this: that
> > ETERNAL SUNSHINE is the FIGHT CLUB that I've been waiting for,
> > significantly more satisfying as a studio-derived experimental film
> > and far more dazzling as a box of tricks. (Although I like FC
> quite a
> > bit.)
>
> >
> > -Jaime
8770

From:
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 7:30pm
Subject: Quantifying Plot

Discussions of "how much plot" a film (or book) has foundered completely, 3 months ago.
I kept saying that "Lost in Translation" had litle plot, many other people kept saying it was full of plot.
Perhaps what we need is a 0 to 10 scale, like those used to measure storms or earthquakes.
0 could be exemplified by "Empire" (Andy Warhol) - no plot.
10 by such prose mystery novels as "The Three Coffins" (John Dickson Carr) or "The Greek Coffin Mystery" (Ellery Queen) - fabulously complex plots.

On such a scale, one suspects that "Lost in Translation" would measure about 2. It has a little plot, but not much.

Mike Grost
grateful that Sophia Coppola has spoken up about plotlessness in her film!
Maybe sometime in the not too distant future, everyone in Film Studies can come to an agreement about whether "Lost in Translation" and other films have much plot or not.
8771

From: Henrik Sylow
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 9:16pm
Subject: Re: Quantifying Plot

I don't understand the fuss about plot quantity. There is a great
measurement for plot quantity, its called cardinal functions and are
part of Ronald Barthe's narrative theory.

"Plotless" films have a surplus of indicies and functions,
while "plotfull" films are heavy on the cardinal side.

I makes little sense to argue for either of, as the purpose of a
narrative is to tell a story and as long as it has been done, the
way is irrelevant.

Henrik

PS: I love "Lost in Translation"

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
> Discussions of "how much plot" a film (or book) has foundered
completely, 3 months ago.
> I kept saying that "Lost in Translation" had litle plot, many
other people kept saying it was full of plot.
> Perhaps what we need is a 0 to 10 scale, like those used to
measure storms or earthquakes.
> 0 could be exemplified by "Empire" (Andy Warhol) - no plot.
> 10 by such prose mystery novels as "The Three Coffins" (John
Dickson Carr) or "The Greek Coffin Mystery" (Ellery Queen) -
fabulously complex plots.
>
> On such a scale, one suspects that "Lost in Translation" would
measure about 2. It has a little plot, but not much.
>
> Mike Grost
> grateful that Sophia Coppola has spoken up about plotlessness in
her film!
> Maybe sometime in the not too distant future, everyone in Film
Studies can come to an agreement about whether "Lost in Translation"
and other films have much plot or not.
8772

From: Kevin Lee
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 9:00pm
Subject: Re: hit-and-run ETERNAL SUNSHINE remark

My reaction to darlin' Clementine is very similar to yours. Now I'm
wondering if I misread Jeremy's complaint -- now it just sounds like
he was just annoyed by Winslet, whereas I thought he was saying he
found the film irretrievably chauvinistic in its set-up.

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> I was actually at peace with the nature of Kate Winslet's
character, it's very logical that she
> should act the way she does, on account of The Plot and stuff.
Jeremy got this too, but he
> said, "but still..." So to me she was like hypothetically, or
comfortably, abrasive, and to
> Jeremy she was overly abrasive, like she *really* bugged him. Plus
I've known girls like
> that, though, dated some even (sheesh), so I can relate and it took
me a lot further, rather
> than puting me off. I even found her likable and sweet some of the
time. She's very
> realistic.

What do you guys think, respectively, of Hepburn in BRINGING UP
BABY? I can imagine someone being irritated to no end by Hepburn,
but for me her performance is totally in synch with the anarchic
spirit of the film. In the case of both movies I think they pull off
the neat trick of having a woman who more or less amounts to a
symbolic object within what's more or less a male narrative
perspective (we identify more with Carrey/Grant than Winslet/Hepburn)
but in such a way that the woman still manages to achieve her own
(subversive) three-dimensional presence and personality, occupying a
space beyond the control of the male gaze. (sorry, I don't mean to
sound like a Lacan wannabe, it just happens to suit the point I'm
trying to make).

In any case I agree that the film doesn't have to tell both sides
from both perspectives to be rich and balanced and complex -- and
it's the fact of not knowing Clementine "from within" that makes it a
true representation of how relationships work their frustrating magic
on us romantic saps.

>
> p.s. When I leave comments I say "comments," so there shouldn't be
any suspense. (I
> hope!)
Well then I guess the suspense would lie in "why the heck didn't he
write comments?" ;-)
8773

From:
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 7:07pm
Subject: Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

Sophia Coppola was honored at the Museum of Modern Art:
http://movies.yahoo.com/news/iw/20040402/108092778000.html

A brief quote from the article:
Coppola showed off her humble side when she said that the success of "Lost in Translation" was a surprise: "It was cool that so many! people saw it," she said, before adding with a laugh, "It didn't have a plot or anything."

So Coppola herself regards her film as plotless.
I set off a firestorm of controversy three months ago, by saying that "Lost in Translation" was basically plotless, or had minimal plotting.
Coppola and I agree!

Mike Grost
(This is not an April Fool's Day hoax!)
8774

From: Craig Keller
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 11:15pm
Subject: Re: Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

> A brief quote from the article:
> Coppola showed off her humble side when she said that the success of
> "Lost in Translation" was a surprise: "It was cool that so many!
> people saw it," she said, before adding with a laugh, "It didn't have
> a plot or anything."
>
> So Coppola herself regards her film as plotless.
> I set off a firestorm of controversy three months ago, by saying that
> "Lost in Translation" was basically plotless, or had minimal plotting.
> Coppola and I agree!

Some movies have "beated plots," others don't.

So what?

craig.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8775

From:
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 8:11pm
Subject: Re: Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

It may or may not matter whether a movie is highly plotted or nearly plotless.
That is a whole 'nother discussion!
Many people on the list argued forcefully & intelligently that large or
small, plot did not matter in film - only visual style, texture and mise-en-scene.
Those things ARE so important, that sometimes I almost agree with them about
plot being irrelevant.

But it least I was not imagining things when "Lost in Translation" seemed
largely plotless last January.
This plotlessness is part of Coppola's own conception of the movie!

Relieved in Detroit,
Mike Grost
8776

From: jpcoursodon
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 0:54am
Subject: Re: Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
> Sophia Coppola was honored at the Museum of Modern Art:

>
> So Coppola herself regards her film as plotless.
> I set off a firestorm of controversy three months ago, by saying
that "Lost in Translation" was basically plotless, or had minimal
plotting.
> Coppola and I agree!
>
> Mike Grost

I don't think anybody denied that the film was plotless or had
minimal plotting. What supporters of the film (myself included)
objected to was the use of "plotless" as a pejorative term branding
the film as "bad" because it doesn't have a traditional kind of plot
(with three acts, an 'arc", conflict, resolution etc...) Actually one
could argue that it's much less plotless than it looks (it is a
narrative, it is constructed -- that in itself comes under "plot";
there was a script, it's not improvised, it's not Warhol either.) But
the point is that a film should not be judged by how much or how
little plot it sports. I think your diatribe at the time linked "Lost
in Translation" with a Tsai Ming-Liang film (can't remember which)
which was also branded as "plotless". Of course his films are. That's
part of what makes them interesting (or you might say that they have
a different approach to plot). In any case no reason in itself to
declare them worthless.

JPC
8777

From: jpcoursodon
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 1:31am
Subject: Re: Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
But it least I was not imagining things when "Lost in Translation"
seemed
> largely plotless last January.
> This plotlessness is part of Coppola's own conception of the movie!
>
> Relieved in Detroit,
> Mike Grost

Dear Relieved:

I'm sorry the post I sent in response to yours about an hour ago
seems to have been lost in translation! I won't bother to rewrite it.
I was just making the point that no one challenged your argument that
the film was "plotless" or had "minimal plotting". The whole
controversy started because you stated or implied that the film was
bad because of its plotlessness (real or imagined).

Samuel Beckett's plays do seem "plotless" compared to Shakespeare's,
Racine's or Agatha Christie's. Is it reason enough to say they're bad
theater?

JPC
8778

From:
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 8:31pm
Subject: Color and Architecture in 2 Robert Mulligan films

The Nickel Ride

Throughout the first half of The Nickel Ride, Mulligan employs color schemes
of white, offset by swaths of some other bright color - yellow, red or blue.
Usually only one bright color appears in a sequence. A section of the film will
be all white and yellow, followed by another long stretch that is all white
and red, followed by another sequence in turn that is all white and blue. This
sort of color architecture a personal color pattern - it shows up again in The
Man in the Moon, which has major sequences of white and green, and shorter
sequences of white and red.

The early scenes of The Nickel Ride are designed in shades of white and
yellow. White is perhaps a more predominant color, with big swaths of yellow, gold,
or light beige tones. These scenes include hero Cooper at home, first in bed,
then on the phone, then getting breakfast and getting dressed. The idea of
opening a film with a character in bed, full of intense feeling and pondering
about issues in his life, will recur in The Man in the Moon.

The still life on the cop's table, with phone, badge, book, etc. is a
memorable composition. Much of it is in shades of yellow.

When the action switches to the street, with Cooper fully dressed in his
suit, we have a new color scheme: white with swaths of red. The red includes
Cooper's dark red tie, the red jacket worn by the street peddler, red frames and
stools in the bar, the red andwhite shirt and tie worn by the man sleeping in
the office, and the red cap of the man by the pool.

The bar is rectangular, but with a corner cut off making an angle. Later, the
garage door in The Man in the Moon will have similar cut-off corner angles.

While in the middle of the pool scene, the colors suddenly shift. They now
become blue and white, beginning with the boxer and the blue accents and trim on
his clothes. This color scheme persists back at Cooper's office, with the
black characters in the blue shirts, and in the birthday party bar scene. There
are even blue candles on the chocolate cake. The bar scene occasionally has
flashes of the other color schemes: the peddler in red shows up, the middle cake
is slightly yellow, etc. But most of the color accents and clothes in the bar
are blue, against a white background.

When Carl (John Hillerman) shows up, we shift to red and white again. Carl's
car is a dark red, nearly as dark as Cooper's tie, and Carl's clothes are
reddish in shade as well. We return to the warehouse, with its red brick, The shot
where the car moves in parallel to the walking Cooper and Carl is a symphony
of dark red and brick red tones.

The red and white persist in the shots at the concession stand at theboxing
arena, and in the kitchen scene following it at the bar. Mulligan loves
kitchens, and people getting food. The kitchen table in front of Cooper is another of
Mulligan's carefully composed still lifes.

Repeating Structures

Mulligan uses many repeating architectural structures in the urban scenes in
the first half of the film: the arches at the warehouse, the windows in both
Cooper's home and office - each window with its own window shade - the facades
of the downtown buildings. The windows repeat and repeat, in long rows and
series.

The wire fence along which Cooper walks in his first episode downtown
anticipates the farm fence in The Man in the Moon. Such repeating structures make up
a key aspect of Mulligan's visual style. The first shot of the countryside
involves a series of repeating trees along the shore. These anticipate the
repeating trees along the drive in The Man in the Moon.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Man in the Moon

The family's house has prominent triangular gables, along its upper reaches.
These are soon echoed by a similarly shaped triangular steeple at the church.
Both the church and the gables are pure white, which adds to their echoing
effect. The family house is seen as some sort of church. Just as the house is
tied to nature through its colors, it is tied to religion through its shapes.
There is a sense of the sacred here. Mulligan's stories often have a surreal
tone, lurking just under their surface realism.

The fact that the mother is pregnant here adds to the sense of religious
fertility. Even the church is flanked by huge masses of blooming flowers of its
shrubs.

The films' focus on sisters living in a lush natural environment, and its
concern with themes of awakening first love, birth and death, recall Jean
Renoir's The River (1951). So do a number of plot elements in the picture: a large
country house filled with young women on the brink of adulthood; innocent but
powerful crushes on a young man in the neighborhood, the final destiny of a
young man at the end of the film.

As is often the case with Mulligan, the characters live near water, and water
or dockside scenes play a prominent role in his films. The swimming area
recalls the river in front of the cabin in The Nickel Ride. Both are views from
overhead angles, involving a firm shore area bordering a still body of water.
The food shots here also recall The Nickel Ride. Both films have scenes of eggs
cooking for breakfast. And the shot of the chocolate cake here at the picnic
recalls the birthday cakes in The Nickel Ride, two of which are also chocolate.

There are echoes here of earlier Mulligan protagonists. The difficult,
demanding father here recalls other hard to get along with fathers in Fear Strikes
Out and Blood Brothers. The young hero meets the same ultimate destiny asCooper
in The Nickel Ride. And the father's refusal to take part in organized
religion here recalls the noble but atheistic doctor in The Spiral Road. By
contrast, the wives of both of these characters are practicing Evangelical Christians.
Mulligan treats the religious beliefs of both husbands and wives in these
pictures with respect, a somewhat rare attitude.

Colors

The Man in the Moon (1991) is designed in a mixture of green and white. The
house and garage exteriors are painted these two colors. So is the car driven
by the young man. When we get to the country club, there are over a dozen cars,
all in shades of green and white. Many of the clothes worn by the characters
also fall into the same scheme, although there are also some pale blues. The
lush green scenery also blends into this same color pattern. In fact, one
suspects that the green and white is intended to make the human buildings, vehicles
and clothes match the colors of nature. The world is one big seamless mass of
natural lushness and greenery in this film.

There are exceptions. The pickup truck is brown, and so is the dusty road and
drive at the farm. These are used for a color harmony at one point. And
downtown, we get a store front that is a dazzling mix of red and white. The shots
tracking along this store front makes a brief exception and change of pace to
the rest of the film.

Repeating Structures

Mulligan likes repeating architectural structures in the backgrounds of his
shots. The back porch where the girls sleep at the opening is an example. It is
made up of a series of vertical sections, each one with its own blinds. The
repeating posts and blinds make a sequence of zones, stretching across the
screen. This is an archetypal Mulligan location. Soon, we see the inside of the
porch. It too consists of a number of regions. Mulligan often frames his shots
so that the different regions, each with its own vertical dividing posts, are
spread out from left to right along the screen.

Later outdoor shots sometimes involve similar repeating structures. Mulligan
does much with a wire fence, which has a series of repeating posts. Even when
Mulligan shows the giant trees in the family's driveway, he pans along a whole
series of them, stretched along the drive.

The barn at Court's property has a series of repeating wooden regions in its
interior. These are all closed up, and probably contain stuff. They remind one
of the storage bins in The Nickel Ride, with their unseen contents.

The film is full of Mulligan's languorous but powerful camera movements.
These maintain a sense of propulsion, but also have a slow, contemplative feel.

Mike Grost
8779

From:
Date: Fri Apr 2, 2004 9:06pm
Subject: Re: [Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

Dear JPC,
I did not mean to ignore your well written post! It only arrived here AFTER
my recent message! Sorry.
My own memory of last January is different. It seemed that many posts were
saying "Lost in Translation" and "What Time Is It There?" were full of complex
plotting. I was deeply confused by this at the time. It seemed (and still
seems) that they both have simple, minimal plots - around 2 on a scale of 0 to 10.
(And by the way, I DO like Tsai's "The Hole".)
I DID argue last January that all other things being equal, a film with a
complex plot is superior to one with a simple one. This is a controversial idea.
I only learned last January HOW controversial (the flaming arrows are still
burning!). The pros and cons of this argument might not be covered again here.
I DO admire other things than plot, and deeply admire many films that have
little plot, because of their great visual style. Perfect examples are found in
many experimental films: Brakhage, Belson, Jack Smith, etc.
By "plot", I hardly require the dismal three-act formulas of current hack
scriptwriting textbooks. Instead, I cited such examples of classic plots as "The
Searchers", "Metropolis", "Madame de.." and "The Birds", and such outstanding
modern films as "Karacter", "Sucre amer", "Nowhere in Africa", "Souzhou
River", "Malena", "Dr. Akagi", "Gosford Park" and others.
I'm sorry I descended to diatribes last winter. I do have a deep love of
highly plotted movies. I'm pleading with a_film_by members to keep an open mind,
and be receptive to the glories of highly plotted cinema.

Mike Grost
8780

From: jpcoursodon
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 4:27am
Subject: Re: [Lost in Translation: Plotless Cinema?

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, MG4273@a... wrote:
> Dear JPC,
> I did not mean to ignore your well written post! It only arrived
here AFTER
> my recent message! Sorry.

I didn't think you ignored it, I really thought it was lost
because it took more than an hour to post!

> I DID argue last January that all other things being equal, a film
with a
> complex plot is superior to one with a simple one. This is a
controversial idea.

Very controversial. Because obviously there are countless films
with complex plots that are very inferior to lots of films with much
simpler plots. It's just not something you can seriously argue!

> I'm sorry I descended to diatribes last winter. I do have a deep
love of
> highly plotted movies. I'm pleading with a_film_by members to keep
an open mind,
> and be receptive to the glories of highly plotted cinema.
>
> Mike Grost

But it's not a matter of being for or against highly plotted
cinema! It's just about being for good cinema, plotfull or plotless
or in-between.
And perhaps the concept of plot should be redefined so that
useless, pointless arguments might be avoided.

By the way your analysis of Nickel Ride and Man in the Moon was
great.

JPC
8781

From: hotlove666
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 7:29pm
Subject: Pas sur la bouche

The new Resnais film played last night at the DGA to a rapturous full
house includin a_film_by members David E., Joseph K and me. Based on
a 1925 comic operetta, with a cast of Resnais regulars augmented by
Audrey Tatou and French clown Darryl Cowl (as "Madame Foin"), Pas sur
la bouche delivers the pure pleasure of great Lubitsch, Minnelli or
Donen and reminds us once again what the idea of mise en scene as an
artform is all about.

It's ironic that as Resnais has kept getting closer to his dream of
being an American director, his texts have become untranslatably
French: this one in particular (thanks to ill-advised rhyming
subtitles). For non-French speakers I would almost recommend reading
a detailed plot summary and then just relaxing and watching and
listening as one would with an opera in a foreign tongue, only
occasionally glancing at the titles for reference.

This operetta trouvee (it was in a stack of operettas AR's producer
procured for him from the National Library when a grim-sounding
silent film project called "Or.." fell through) is a lost gem in
itself, text (full of puns and other kinds of play: two love duets
constructed in echo-rhyme, for example) and music flawlessly
integrated. Resnais' cast - with Lambert Wilson the only lead who has
singing experience - imbue it with life and wit beyond what a
professional opera company could deliver: smoky-voiced Sabine Azema,
the muse of this last Resnais period, is especially brilliant in her
delivery of the non-sung dialogue, managing to make "Chic!" a
polysyllabic word, for example, when hubby Pierre Arditi announces
that their fortune is about to be multiplied by ten.

Visually, the film is a feast: highly colored fantasy sets shot by
Renato Berta using what looked like fog filter to heighten the glamor
in many scenes, constant invention which apparently involved AR
trying things by shooting Star Wars action figures in model sets with
a little video camera, zillion-dollar dresses for the ladies, tours
de force in homage to Lady from Shanghai, Lady Windemere's Fan,
Vertigo.

AR does something new with the actors' exits which I won't spoil by
describing - in any case, do not imagine that this is a static piece
of filmed theatre a la Smoking/No Smoking. This is cinema at a level
we haven't seen in a long time. Lambert Wilson presented and answered
questions (including one from Randall Kleiser, one of several
directors in the audience) much more candidly and searchingly than
Resnais would have had he been there. I want the soundtrack album now!
8782

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 7:50pm
Subject: Re: Pas sur la bouche

--- hotlove666 wrote:
Pas sur
> la bouche delivers the pure pleasure of great
> Lubitsch, Minnelli or
> Donen and reminds us once again what the idea of
> mise en scene as an
> artform is all about.
>
Indeed it does. And while French to its fingertips it
(curiously enough) also reminded me or such
smaller-scaled U.S. musicals as "Give a Girl a Break"
and "I Love Melvin."

Lambert Wilson was remarkably eloquent for an actor.
Full of information about the film -- and films in
general. The fact that he knew how many shots were in
the Resnais and how man in the "Matrix" films (which
he's also in) was terribly impressive. As I write I'm
listening to the album he cut for Angel/EMI in 1989:
"Musicals." He sings (perfectly) Bernstein ("Maria,"
"It Must Be So"), Kern ("The Way You Look Tonight," "A
Fine Romance"), Frank Loesser ("Never Will I Marry"),
Cole Porter ("You Do Something To Me," "Night and
Day"), Schwartz & Dietz ("Alone Together"),Lerner &
Lowe ("There But For You Go I"), Kurt Weill ("Love
Song" from the ulra-obscure "Love Life") and of course
Sondheim("Finishing the Hat," "Johanna," "Silly
People")
In other words he totally satisfies my desire for a
gay French Howard Keel.

__________________________________
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8783

From: michelle carey
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 10:43pm
Subject: Re: Pas sur la bouche

Thankyou Bill and David for your responses to Pas sur la bouche. I¹m dying
to see it more than ever now and am so grateful for Resnais for keeping the
comédie-musicale alive (still waiting in anguish for the next Jacques
Rivette musical!). Have you seen the 1931 film? You can indeed purchase the
musical soundtrack to Resnais¹ film here:

http://www.amazon.fr/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000X0V5G/402-2087616-6327348

By listening to the song samples I understand what you mean by the rhyming
how very charming!

Michelle

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8784

From: Hadrian
Date: Sat Apr 3, 2004 11:25pm
Subject: Victor Erice

Does anybody know any where in the world where "El Sur" has been
released with subtitles? I found a DVD in Spain, but, alas, no
English.

hadrian
8785

From: hotlove666
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 1:28am
Subject: Re: Pas sur la bouche

> http://www.amazon.fr/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0000X0V5G/402-2087616-6327348
>
> By listening to the song samples I understand what you mean by the
rhyming
> how very charming!
>
> Michelle
>
>Thanks, Michelle. A message from a friend who was there last night
confirms my sense that the rhymed subtitles really get in the way -
use them in small doses when you do see it!
8786

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 4:25am
Subject: another Fuller rarity coming to DVD

After a wonderful edition of the underrated STREET OF NO RETURN,
Fantoma is releasing DEAD PIGEON ON BEETHOVEN STREET. "Soon."
Christa is doing the audio commentary! This is a really good film,
maybe too strange for normal people but super for Fuller devotees.

Fantoma is an even more niche-y version of the Criterion Collection,
going all out for each disc they release. (And besides Criterion,
they're one of the main providers for seeing Fassbinder on DVD.)

-Jaime
8787

From: jtakagi@e...
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 4:36am
Subject: RE: Victor Erice

With English subtitles? I have the Japanese release, with
Japanese subtitles.

Original Message:
-----------------

Does anybody know any where in the world where "El Sur" has been
released with subtitles? I found a DVD in Spain, but, alas, no
English.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
mail2web - Check your email from the web at
http://mail2web.com/ .
8788

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 4:42am
Subject: Under Capricorn?

Saw this on DVD the other day and was very, very impressed. Probably
wouldn't have watched it, were it not for Dave Kehr's euphoric praise
- " Easily one of Alfred Hitchcock's half dozen greatest films" - but
glad I did.

His capsule review, which can be found here

http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/8757_UNDER_CAPRICORN

says it all for me, does anyone have anything to add? (Subtract?)

-Jaime
8789

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 6:44am
Subject: Re: another Fuller rarity coming to DVD

What I'm longing for is that they'll bring out some
obscure Rivette like "Duelle," "Noroit" and "Merry Go
Round."

And how about Duras' "India Song" and "Son Nom du
Venise dans Calcutta Desert" ?

--- "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> After a wonderful edition of the underrated STREET
> OF NO RETURN,
> Fantoma is releasing DEAD PIGEON ON BEETHOVEN
> STREET. "Soon."
> Christa is doing the audio commentary! This is a
> really good film,
> maybe too strange for normal people but super for
> Fuller devotees.
>
> Fantoma is an even more niche-y version of the
> Criterion Collection,
> going all out for each disc they release. (And
> besides Criterion,
> they're one of the main providers for seeing
> Fassbinder on DVD.)
>
> -Jaime
>
>

__________________________________
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8790

From: Jaime N. Christley
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 6:58am
Subject: Re: another Fuller rarity coming to DVD

All those you named would be perfect for Criterion or Fantoma. When
Criterion releases something rare, it becomes a little less rare, and
they move the film from the netherworld of "what happened to that
film?" to something many people can see at any time.

Do you have any influence at all with Criterion from your association
as an essay-writer? You might consider dropping a hint or two.

-Jaime

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein wrote:
> What I'm longing for is that they'll bring out some
> obscure Rivette like "Duelle," "Noroit" and "Merry Go
> Round."
>
> And how about Duras' "India Song" and "Son Nom du
> Venise dans Calcutta Desert" ?
>
> --- "Jaime N. Christley"
> wrote:
> > After a wonderful edition of the underrated STREET
> > OF NO RETURN,
> > Fantoma is releasing DEAD PIGEON ON BEETHOVEN
> > STREET. "Soon."
> > Christa is doing the audio commentary! This is a
> > really good film,
> > maybe too strange for normal people but super for
> > Fuller devotees.
> >
> > Fantoma is an even more niche-y version of the
> > Criterion Collection,
> > going all out for each disc they release. (And
> > besides Criterion,
> > they're one of the main providers for seeing
> > Fassbinder on DVD.)
> >
> > -Jaime
> >
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/design_giveaway/
8791

From:
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 4:39am
Subject: Ray Nazarro: Minor Musical Westerns

The Encore Western chanel is showing two B movies directed by Ray Nazarro,
and written by Barry Shipman:
Hoedown (1950)
The Rough, Tough West (1952)
These are little hour-long Westerns. Each is so full of Country Western music
that they qualify as musicals. The films are in black and white. The films
are entertaining, and full of good storytelling, in a somewhat nutty, zany style.
Hoedown is a backstage spoof of show business, including Western movies and
singers.
The Rough, Tough West is a "serious" Western, about one of those towns under
the control of an ambitious, greedy land baron (see Budd Boetticher's
"Horizons West", or Joseph H. Lewis' "A Lawless Street", two films with a much bigger
budget than this one.)
Both films star much of the same casts. The biggest male roles in each film
go to stunt man turned actor Jock Mahoney. He is not the "star" in either film,
but a supporting player. He is an idiot cowboy actor in Hoedown, and the land
baron in The Rough, Tough West. In each film, he is partnered with leading
lady Carolina Cotton, a country singer known for her yodeling. Actor turned
B-Movie director Fred F. Sears also has character roles in these.
I had never heard of Nazarro, Shipman, or these films. They are worth looking
at as examples of pleasant B movie filmmaking, from a long vanished era.

Mike Grost
8792

From: f-verissimo
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 8:47am
Subject: Re: Modern horror and world cinema

> From: Adrian Martin
> Subject: Modern horror and world cinema
>
> where are all the
> contemporary horror movies about socio-political terrors,
we have no
> shortage of such topics in the world today!!

well, I don´t really think any of you will agree with this (I
know that my brazilian buddies will), but I´d point M. Night
Shyamalan as a true successor of Romero, Carpenter and
Hooper, in the tradition of the 70´s horror. He knows the
horror genre upside down and he seems to be trying really
hard to make a point on social-political issues. It is true
that he does not share Romero´s satirical-liberal view, much
less the openly radical approach of Hooper or Craven early
work, but his last two films strike me as powerful allegories
in the "unconscious-social-reflection school" tradition that
Adrian points out.

It seems to me that he´s systematically stretching his
fingers to something bigger (although he can´t quite grab it)
as time passes -- from that single person passing through a
crisis of faith (played by himself) in his first film to the
flawed family structure of SIGNS, there´s a strong tendency
to reflect on social relations and collective (and
unconscious) fears. His new film, THE VILLAGE, will probably
go further on that.

I wrote somewhere that I thought SIGNS was a bizarre Disney
version of THE THING MEETS NIGHT OF THE LIVING DEAD. By the
time I saw it, SIGNS seemed to me the first american film
that seriously reflected (unconsciously or not) the impact
september-11 had on american society -- and the first film
that displayed a truly interesting approach on an
apocalyptical menace since, say, DAY OF THE DEAD (Romero´s
masterpiece, IMO).

> I am frankly nostalgic for the
> Romero era, and the better years of Carpenter, Craven, etc.

so am I! (although I really like some recent works by Romero -
- BRUISER -- and Carpenter -- GHOSTS OF MARS)

> Bill: where can we read your Torino essay on zombies?

I´d love to read it too!

Fernando

---
Acabe com aquelas janelinhas que pulam na sua tela.
AntiPop-up UOL - É grátis!
http://antipopup.uol.com.br
8793

From:
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 5:10am
Subject: M. Night Shyamalan - Unbreakable

Unbreakable was cited by David Bordwell in his look at current Hollywood film
styles (in Film Quarterly). Its long takes and relatively few total shots
distinguish it from the current Hollywood norm, in which the camera set-up
changes every few seconds. This "nervous camera" can drive one crazy, in commercial
films today.
Unbreakable is about comic books and their readers. It drew mixed reactions
from comic book scholars. One comic book archivist-historian told me he enjoyed
the film, and thought it was great that a movie was paying attention to comic
books.
By contrast, I had qualms. Unbreakable depicts comic book readers as being
part of a strange subculture. It suggests that comic book fans are really,
really weird. Why oh why, the film wonders, would any grown-up read a comic book?
What is our motivation, as actors used to say? Must be something really outre...
I read comic books for the same reason I read poetry, go to the opera and
ballet, and look at paintings. I want to experience something beautiful.
The real mystery is why EVERYBODY does not read comics.

Mike Grost
8794

From:
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 5:38am
Subject: Barthe and Bournonville

Henrik Sylow writes about Barthe's "narrative theory", and quantifying plot.
I've never read a word of Barthe - I know nothing about philosophy and rarely
read it. Sometime, could you please tell me in which book of Barthe's this is
found. Sounds very interesting.
By contrast, love ballet in general and Auguste Bournonville in particular,
also mentioned by Henrik in a recent post. Bournonville's ballets, such as "La
Sylphide" (1836) and "Napoli" (1842), are some of the most beautiful narrative
works ever. Wish I could leap and bound as they do in Bournonville Ballet. In
Denmark lucky people get to see these on stage. Here in the US, mainly know
these from TV broadcasts.
Just don't throw a green scarf over me...

Mike Grost
8795

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 2:25pm
Subject: Re: Barthe and Bournonville

--- MG4273@a... wrote:
> Henrik Sylow writes about Barthe's "narrative
> theory", and quantifying plot.
> I've never read a word of Barthe - I know nothing
> about philosophy and rarely
> read it. Sometime, could you please tell me in which
> book of Barthe's this is
> found. Sounds very interesting.

S/Z -- a detailed examination of a story by Balzac. It
really should be taught in film classes.

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8796

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 2:29pm
Subject: Re: Re: another Fuller rarity coming to DVD

--- "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> All those you named would be perfect for Criterion
> or Fantoma. When
> Criterion releases something rare, it becomes a
> little less rare, and
> they move the film from the netherworld of "what
> happened to that
> film?" to something many people can see at any time.
>
> Do you have any influence at all with Criterion from
> your association
> as an essay-writer? You might consider dropping a
> hint or two.
>
I really ought to get in touch with them. The last
time I worked for Criterion I wrote notes for their
DVD of Barbet Schroeder's "Idi Amin Dada."

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8797

From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 2:34pm
Subject: Re: Under Capricorn?

I wouldn't go nearly that far. It's a fascinating film
-- particularly as regards Hitchcock's obsession with
Ingrid Bergman -- but it's not a success for reasons
that Hitchcock himself makes plain in Truffaut's
interview. Joseph Cotton is miscast. it should have
been Robert Newton.

"Cahiers" was quite over the moon about "Under
Capricorn" back in the day. As it wasn't a thriller
itproved that Hitchcok ought to be taken seriously as
an artist, as far as they were concerned. Moreover,
Bergman's climactic confession appealed to the
Catholic in them all -- especially Rohmer.

Purely as a piece of mise en scene one can see its
obvious influence on "The Marquise of O" and "The Lady
and the Duke."

--- "Jaime N. Christley"
wrote:
> Saw this on DVD the other day and was very, very
> impressed. Probably
> wouldn't have watched it, were it not for Dave
> Kehr's euphoric praise
> - " Easily one of Alfred Hitchcock's half dozen
> greatest films" - but
> glad I did.
>
> His capsule review, which can be found here
>
>
http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/8757_UNDER_CAPRICORN
>
> says it all for me, does anyone have anything to
> add? (Subtract?)
>
> -Jaime
>
>

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8798

From: Fred Camper
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 3:59pm
Subject: Re: Under Capricorn?

First, my apologies -- the press of all sorts of work and travel
preparations have given me just about zero free time, and I've had to
virtually stop reading messages here for the time being. If someone
calls someone else a dufus retard, please email Peter and myself.

About "Under Capricorn," I agree with Dave K. rather than David E. My
other favorite Hitchcocks: "Vertigo," "I Confess," "Marnie," "Psycho"
and "Shadow of a Doubt." That's my half dozen

I think the ending of "Under Capricorn" is flawed, externalizing the
causes of the protagonist's (the Bergman character) troubles -- it never
happens quite that crudely in "Vertigo" or even "Psycho." Otherwise it's
a tremendously great film. The long-take mise en scene and pastel colors
beautifully convey the instability of the protagonist's identity, as is
"materialized" in the film's key moment, when she is asked to view her
reflection in a window: the reality she is supposed to be given here is
instead fleeting. This is one of those great moments in Hollywood cinema
in which a single image serves as a metaphor for the whole style. The
special effects "vertigo" shots in "Vertigo" are similar, except I've
never especially loved those shots. The pov shots of the rooms in the
"Psycho" house near the end is/are a better example. Analogs in the work
of other filmmakers include the famous television reflection image in
"All That Heaven Allows," or the last shot of "A Time to Love and a Time
to Die," or the death mask in "The Tarnished Angles" -- Sirk is
especially great at such images. But there are others: the very first
shot of Fuller's "Fixed Bayonets," the frozen moments in "How Green Was
My Valley" (the family stops for a moment on the word "America" when two
sons say they're planning to leave), the in and out of focus long take
near the end of "Detour."

A piece of trivia: a line I've never been able to understand in "Under
Capricorn" is the maid's explanation for why she is called "Crumpets"
(or is it "Crumpet"). If anyone knows what it is (please don't spend
time on any "research") please post.

- Fred C.
8799

From: Richard Modiano
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 3:58pm
Subject: Re: Under Capricorn?

--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:

"Bergman's climactic confession appealed to the
Catholic in them all -- especially Rohmer."

In 1994 a gentleman from the British Film Institute (I forget his
name; he did an impeccable imitation of Hitchcock too) screened a
restored print of UNDER CAPRICORN at UCLA. He also screened the
climatic confession shown as a flashback. I don't remeber that he
provided an explanation as to why Hitchcock decided not to use it,
and some of it can be seen in the trailer which was also screened.
(In spite of Joseph Cotton's mis-casting I think UNDER CAPRICORN is
superb.)

Richard
8800

From: Maxime Renaudin
Date: Sun Apr 4, 2004 5:58pm
Subject: Ulmer's The Naked Dawn

Someone here get the bright idea to re-release both "The Naked Dawn"
and "The Black Cat", alternately in the same theater. I'd like to
believe, for a moment, that the beauty of this unique film (The
Naked Dawn) is shared beyond the happy few. May the water stream
down the naked legs of Betta St. John not in vain. By the way, I did
not remember that Kennedy missed that scene, just for the pigs and
chicks... The admirable sequence shot coming next, with Kennedy and
Betta St. John in the kitchen, moves me every time. With the rise
and fall of the "women of Vera Cruz", the shot turns over within a
continuous breath, extracting the naked truth with a rare substance
in characters' feelings. Kennedy is great.
Maxime

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