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Posts From the Internet Film Discussion Group, a_film_by
This group is dedicated to discussing film as art
from an auteurist perspective. The index to these files of posts can be found at http://www.fredcamper.com/afilmby/ The purpose of these files is to make our posts more accessible, for downloading and reading and to search engines.
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15601
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 7:54pm
Subject: Re: World Cinema and the recession
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Craig Keller
wrote:
part of that something-bad is the unwillingness of once capably
> funded filmmakers to make small, self-financed, ten-, twenty-,
> forty-minute films without budgets or stars, shot on 16mm or
on DV.
>
> craig.
As Charles Burnett did with When It Rains, as Soderbergh did
with Schizopolis. When it Rains is arguably still Charles' best
film since To Sleep with Anger (including Nightjohn, which I like
a lot), and Schizopolis is Soderbergh's best in who knows how
long! But people who have swum in the Olympic-sized pool
rarely want to go back to the old water hole, however agreeably
rustic the surroundings may be.
15602
From: Robert Keser
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 7:55pm
Subject: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Dan Sallitt wrote:
>
> I'm not a Wise fan (though the Cahiers people were kindly disposed
> toward him, as I recall), nor did I even enjoy CURSE that much on
> my one long-ago viewing. But for some reason I really like THE >
> BODY SNATCHER, which I think is the most Hitchcockian film not
made by Hitchcock. - Dan
Let's spare a thought for Wise's stunningly misanthropic BORN
TO KILL, possibly the darkest film of the 40s both figuratively and
literally (only the downright Stygian CROSSFIRE looks darker). One
could argue that, minute for minute, Richard Widmark's big scene
in KISS OF DEATH (hurling Beulah Bondi-cum-wheelchair down the
stairs)is actually meaner, but that movie had sympathetic characters
for balance. In BORN TO KILL the storytelling sides with the
criminal duo of Claire Trevor and the always scary Lawrence Tierney
as they run rampant over dumber people, and all with a barely
concealed sexual charge. To me, Wise's economical visuals and
commitment to his tough characters here are the justification for
taking him seriously at all.
--Robert Keser
15603
From: samfilms2003
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:07pm
Subject: Re: World Cinema and the recession
>>Stan Brakhage's "Lovesong" (2001) is on very few 10 best lists
It could go on mine, not that I publish these things....
> And part of that something-bad is the unwillingness of once capably
> funded filmmakers to make small, self-financed, ten-, twenty-,
> forty-minute films without budgets or stars, shot on 16mm or on DV.
Interview in this month's Contemporary, or rather a conversation with Jeff Wall,
Mike Figgis seems to be doing just that.
Also I know that Hou bought a Super 16 camera a year or two ago
(but I suspect he's thinking 3 X 2 hours......)
-Sam
15604
From: Craig Keller
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:16pm
Subject: Re: Re: World Cinema and the recession
> Also I know that Hou bought a Super 16 camera a year or two ago
> (but I suspect he's thinking 3 X 2 hours......)
Why are you suspecting this? Have you heard something, or are you
thinking about the six-hour project he mentions at the beginning of the
'Millennium Mambo' interview? I thought he meant that 'Millennium
Mambo' itself was going to be six-hours, but then he decided it was
unrealistic for distribution so he pared the concept down to fit the
average feature length.
craig.
15605
From: peckinpah20012000
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:33pm
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Dan Sallitt wrote:
> > Many people claim
> > that Taiwan, along with Iran, is now the center of film culture.
> > Taiwanese directors, including Yang, Hou and Tsai Ming-liang, are
During a 1997 conference on Asian cinema organized at Peterborough,
Ontario, by the Asian Cinema Studies Society, Mainland Chinese
director Xie Fei astonished everyone by stating that the Taiwanese
New Wave was now dead and mentioned that the "market" aspects of
globalization were now drastically affecting the distinctive nature
of any national cinema.
I don't know how true this is in Taiwan today. But the isolation
affecting one of George W.'s "axis of evil" may be responsible for
the exciting nature of Iranian Cinema today.
Anyway, I believe we are all impressed by the achievements of
Taiwanese cinema and keep wanting to seem more, even if they
represent developments occurring 15 years or so in the past. However,
some films remain perversely elusive. Despite what has been written
about CITY OF SADNESS, I've yet to find a copy with English
subtitles. Some Asian Web Sites such as yes.asia have the film but in
Mandarin only.
Do any members know where one can find CITY OF SADNESS with subs?
Tony Williams
15606
From: peckinpah20012000
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:44pm
Subject: Re: World Cinema and the recession
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:
>
> --- hotlove666 wrote:
> > Filmmaking has been replaced by film marketing.
>
> The state we've sunk to is smmed up by the fact that
> more people are interested in talking about Harvey
> Weinstein than they are about Martin Scorsese.
>
> I quite agree. Only my postmodernist colleagues hailing the
supremacy of the "market" and the "virtues of competition" applaud
this situation. However, for those of you who made for the Exit sign
when confronted with this situation in certain colleges, other
possibilites exist. Many students are not as "dumb and dumber" - (the
quote refers to a certain film screened in an Irony as Public
Discourse Class by a non-film professor which also showed gems such
as SPICEWORLD etc) - as their mentors and enjoy the achievements of
cinema once these are shown to them.
They not only appreciate black and white films but also appreciate
what can be done on a low budget.
But then, I have the autonomy to teach Welles and Peckinpah this
semester and don't have the tenure-track pressures of student
evaluations (often misused by certain Chairs) and false advice
concerning "showmanship" and "entertainment" to keep up the numbers.
Often the numbers rise when students recognize that alternatives are
present, existed in the past, and remain positive influences for the
future.
Tony Williams
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
15607
From: Jonathan Takagi
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:45pm
Subject: RE: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
> Do any members know where one can find CITY OF SADNESS with subs?
There was a PAL VHS released by Artificial Eye, but as far
as I know, there is no DVD release. Contact me off list
if you don't mind converted VHS quality.
Jonathan Takagi
15608
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:20pm
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan Takagi"
wrote:
>
> > Do any members know where one can find CITY OF
SADNESS with subs?
>
> There was a PAL VHS released by Artificial Eye, but as far
> as I know, there is no DVD release. Contact me off list
> if you don't mind converted VHS quality.
>
> Jonathan Takagi
There's also a useful BFI monograph by Berenice Raynaud
which will help you thread your way thru the historical labyrinth of
the story.
15609
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:44pm
Subject: History is made at night
Ah, dear friends, I turn 45 today! Any good 'turning 45' movies anyone can
recommend I should see?
Adrian
15610
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:53pm
Subject: Re: History is made at night
Happy Birthday!
But 45 is a rather odd age-marker. Wait five years.
--- Adrian Martin wrote:
> Ah, dear friends, I turn 45 today! Any good 'turning
> 45' movies anyone can
> recommend I should see?
>
> Adrian
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
15611
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:01pm
Subject: Re: History is made at night
> --- Adrian Martin wrote:
>
> > Ah, dear friends, I turn 45 today! Any good 'turning
> > 45' movies anyone can
> > recommend I should see?
> >
> > Adrian
Happy birthday from another Virgo! (Don't ask...)
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out!
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
15612
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:02pm
Subject: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Damien Bona"
wrote:
> Curse Of The Cat People is a wonderful film, and the rare Hollywood
> movie that conveys the odd state of being that is childhood. Of
> course Lewton had a hand in it, as did Gunther von Fritsch who
> apparentlty had to answer to his draft board in the midst of it
(the
> army couldn't have waited til the end of a three week shoot?).
Still,
> I think it's easily Wise's best picture other than The Sound of
> Music.
Jean-André Fieschi reviewed The Sound of Music in the Cahiers du
Cinéma. He didn't care for the film at all. He wrote that "at the
start Wise's coarse camera flies over Austria's green pastures, as it
did a little to the west, over Manhattan. Then one can believe
happiness is in the meadow where Julie Andrews agreeably frisks
about." But soon our "darkest fears are confirmed" when the
"unspeakable Trapp family" is introduced: "one can believe anything at
all, no longer endure, if one has the strength, the most nauseating
maelstrom of marshmallow and stupidity that has devastated the screens
for a long time." Cahiers had a Council of Ten critics that rated
films from "No use bothering" to "Four stars." Fieschi proposed adding
a sixth category for The Sound of Music, "Not to see under any
pretext."
I haven't seen The Sound of Music in about thirty years, so I remain
neutral. Besides, Fieschi was critical of Sunrise, so he's clearly
hard to please.
Paul
15613
From: peckinpah20012000
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:07pm
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
>
> There's also a useful BFI monograph by Berenice Raynaud
> which will help you thread your way thru the historical labyrinth
of
> the story.
Thanks. I've read this monographh along with an intriguing article
in the latest issue of ASIAN CINEMA which has made me more
determined to see this film.
Tony Williams
15614
From: peckinpah20012000
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:13pm
Subject: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Gallagher"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Damien Bona"
> wrote:
>
>
> I haven't seen The Sound of Music in about thirty years, so I
remain
> neutral. Besides, Fieschi was critical of Sunrise, so he's clearly
> hard to please.
>
> Paul
I believe Julie's co-star Christopher Plummer referred to it as "the
sound of mucus."
Yes, Wise did some good work in the 40s and 50s but he was, after
all, a studio man and followed RKO's commands concerning THE
MAGNIFICENT AMBERSONS. His later work (with some exceptions) does
illustrate the dangers of big budget and production control which
Scorsese's forthcoming Howard Hughes biopic may also reveal. Is this
going to be his version of TUCKER designed to show Harvey that he
can still make money after the problems surrounding THE GANGS OF NEW
YORK, by no means not one of his better films.
Tony Williams
15615
From: Craig Keller
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:24pm
Subject: Re: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
> Yes, Wise did some good work in the 40s and 50s but he was, after
> all, a studio man and followed RKO's commands concerning THE
> MAGNIFICENT AMBERSONS. His later work (with some exceptions) does
> illustrate the dangers of big budget and production control which
> Scorsese's forthcoming Howard Hughes biopic may also reveal. Is this
> going to be his version of TUCKER designed to show Harvey that he
> can still make money after the problems surrounding THE GANGS OF NEW
> YORK, by no means not one of his better films.
Why he cavorts with Weinstein at all is beyond me (although that's been
discussed here once or twice before already). However, 'Gangs of New
York' did make money – it went over $100 million domestically in the
box office, then figuring in international, and DVD... -- I'm pretty
sure the film turned a healthy profit.
craig.
15616
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:36pm
Subject: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Paul Gallagher"
wrote:
>
> I haven't seen The Sound of Music in about thirty years, so I
remain
> neutral. Besides, Fieschi was critical of Sunrise, so he's clearly
> hard to please.
>
> Paul
It can be enjoyed now as gargantuan camp.
15617
From: hotlove666
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:38pm
Subject: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Craig Keller
wrote:
ter films.
>
> Why he cavorts with Weinstein at all is beyond me (although
that's been
> discussed here once or twice before already). However,
'Gangs of New
> York' did make money – it went over $100 million domestically
in the
> box office, then figuring in international, and DVD... -- I'm pretty
> sure the film turned a healthy profit.
>
> craig.
But it was obviously eviscerated -- it feels like the first release cut
of Once Upon a Time in America!
15618
From: Dave Garrett
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 10:47pm
Subject: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Keser" wrote:
> Let's spare a thought for Wise's stunningly misanthropic BORN
> TO KILL, possibly the darkest film of the 40s both figuratively and
> literally (only the downright Stygian CROSSFIRE looks darker). One
> could argue that, minute for minute, Richard Widmark's big scene
> in KISS OF DEATH (hurling Beulah Bondi-cum-wheelchair down the
> stairs)is actually meaner, but that movie had sympathetic characters
> for balance. In BORN TO KILL the storytelling sides with the
> criminal duo of Claire Trevor and the always scary Lawrence Tierney
> as they run rampant over dumber people, and all with a barely
> concealed sexual charge. To me, Wise's economical visuals and
> commitment to his tough characters here are the justification for
> taking him seriously at all.
I take it you've seen Eddie Muller's tremendously entertaining piece
on the screening of BORN TO KILL that took place at the Egyptian
several years ago, with the late Tierney in attendance?
http://www.noircity.com/typewriterLT.html
Ever since reading this, I can't help but think of Tierney's encounter with Robert Wise in the men's room whenever Wise's
name is mentioned.
Dave
15619
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 11:28pm
Subject: Re: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- hotlove666 wrote:
>
> It can be enjoyed now as gargantuan camp.
>
>
Possibly.
But the bottom line is it's not "Curse of the Cat
People."
Wise is personally quite fond of "Star!" despite its
failure to enchant either the public or the critics.
_______________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today!
http://vote.yahoo.com
15620
From: Damien Bona
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 11:57pm
Subject: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Keser" wrote:
> Let's spare a thought for Wise's stunningly misanthropic BORN
> TO KILL, possibly the darkest film of the 40s both figuratively and
> literally (only the downright Stygian CROSSFIRE looks darker). One
> could argue that, minute for minute, Richard Widmark's big scene
> in KISS OF DEATH (hurling Beulah Bondi-cum-wheelchair down the
> stairs)is actually meaner, but that movie had sympathetic
characters
> for balance. In BORN TO KILL the storytelling sides with the
> criminal duo of Claire Trevor and the always scary Lawrence Tierney
> as they run rampant over dumber people, and all with a barely
> concealed sexual charge. To me, Wise's economical visuals and
> commitment to his tough characters here are the justification for
> taking him seriously at all.
I've never seen Born To Kill -- though I'll be on the lookout for it -
- but another Lawrence Tierney vehicle from the same period also
qualifies for the appellation "stunningly misanthropic": Felix
Feist's The Devil Thumbs A Ride. To my dying day, I'll never forget
a scene where Tierney enters a gas station and the attendant proudly
has a picture of his baby daughter on the counter. Noticing her
protuding ears, Tierney snarls that the kid'll probably fly with ears
before she learns how to walk. (Somehow I gotta believe Tierney ad
libbed it.)
It's also supremely tawdry and a featured actress named Betty Lawford
pretty much epitomizes trashiness. DOn't miss it!
15621
From: Damien Bona
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 0:20am
Subject: Re: Rooftops (and a view of cinema therefrom)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:
>
> Wise is personally quite fond of "Star!" despite its
> failure to enchant either the public or the critics.
>
Star! does have a real cult following and I know quite a few people
who hold it dear.
I feel that The Sound of Music works on many levels, but I think
what's most striking is that -- contrary to its reputation as
saccharine glop -- the film possesses an extremely sober world view,
and the joyousness of the musical numbers works contrapuntally
against the grim reality of 1930s Austria.
Then for camp fanciers, there's Eleanor Parker, and Peggy
Wood's "Climb Every Mountain."
And for those who appreciate the supreme perfection of the human
race, there's Julie.
15622
From:
Date: Wed Sep 15, 2004 8:44pm
Subject: Re: Felix E. Feist (was Wise)
There are some brief notes on Felix E. Feist on my web site at:
http://members.aol.com/MG4273/feist.htm
By the way, "Born to Kill" (Robert Wise) has some moments of outrageous fun.
You have to be in the right nasty mood...
"Star" (Wise) might set a record for the number of costume changes of its
leading lady. There are around 140, if memory serves, and the film fascinates
people who like Hollywood costume design.
Mike Grost
15623
From: Fred Camper
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 1:13am
Subject: Re: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
I appreciate Mike's citing of me as one of three admirers of Yang I
gather he respects, along with my friends Jonathan Rosenbaum and John
Belton. I don't think any of us engage in hype, nor are any of us
trend-followers, though Jonathan can be said to be something of a
trend-maker. John Belton is a tenured professor who is not known for
grasping over-ambitiousness at the expense of honesty; I mean, if one of
us likes a filmmaker, it's not likely a response to any hype but a
sincere reaction.
Mike is also right that understanding Yang should begin with the
magnificent "A Brighter Summer Day."
"A Brighter Summer Day" is a truly haunting and meditative film whose
images have a creepy and tenuous distance, almost as if we're seeing the
characters through a tunnel. "Yi Yi" is on the surface far more
sensuous, and its very sensuousness would I think not survive video at
all, because the presence of its colors and surfaces is more tenuous
than it seems to be. I hardly remember the story of "Yi Yi" at all (a
hazard of my peculiar approach to first viewings of subtitled films that
I don't have to write about), but what I do remember of it is things
such as the presence of highways in the backgrounds of buildings,
constructing the peculiarly disorienting spaces of its city. Human
existence is rendered both touching and tenuous by its mix of sensuality
and distancing.
I've never been as interested as most cinephiles seem to be in national
cinemas as categories. I suppose Jean Renoir, Jean-Isidore Isou, and
Robert Bresson do have something in common other than that they all made
films in French, but I have no idea what that might be. I'm not saying
that there are no characteristics of national cinemas, or that an
article purporting to show that Bresson or Godard might some Renoir-ian
roots might not be useful, but rather that directors, the whole output
of one director, studying that, has always proven more fruitful for me
than generalizing about nations.
Fred Camper
15624
From: Robert Keser
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 1:27am
Subject: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Damien Bona"
wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Keser"
wrote:
>
> > Let's spare a thought for Wise's stunningly misanthropic BORN
> > TO KILL,
> ...another Lawrence Tierney vehicle from the same period also
> qualifies for the appellation "stunningly misanthropic": Felix
> Feist's The Devil Thumbs A Ride. To my dying day, I'll never
> forget a scene where Tierney enters a gas station and the
attendant proudly has a picture of his baby daughter on the
counter. Noticing her protuding ears, Tierney snarls that the
kid'll probably fly with ears before she learns how to walk.
(Somehow I gotta believe Tierney ad libbed it.)
>
> It's also supremely tawdry and a featured actress named Betty > >
> Lawford pretty much epitomizes trashiness. DOn't miss it!
Hah! I'd forgotten that "Dumbo" crack. Tierney certainly makes THE
DEVIL THUMBS A RIDE existentially creepy. My (waning) memory of
DEVIL is that Feist's confinement to his cheapo interior set builds
the movie to a real peak of No Exit claustrophobia, while BORN TO
KILL stresses the dramatic fireworks more (with Claire Trevor
arguably a more dangerous match for Tierney than La Lawford).
--Robert Keser
15625
From: Robert Keser
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 1:33am
Subject: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Dave Garrett" wrote:
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Keser"
wrote:
>
> > Let's spare a thought for Wise's stunningly misanthropic BORN
> > TO KILL
> I take it you've seen Eddie Muller's tremendously entertaining
>piece on the screening of BORN TO KILL that took place at the
> Egyptian several years ago, with the late Tierney in attendance?
>
> http://www.noircity.com/typewriterLT.html
>
> Ever since reading this, I can't help but think of Tierney's
> encounter with Robert Wise in the men's room whenever Wise's
> name is mentioned.
Tierney was his own auteur! Seems to me that anybody assigned to
directing him really earned his salary.
--Robert Keser
15626
From: Robert Keser
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 1:42am
Subject: Re: History is made at night
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Adrian Martin
wrote:
> Ah, dear friends, I turn 45 today! Any good 'turning 45' movies
anyone can
> recommend I should see?
Happy birthday, Adrian! I think you should start a project to see
all the movies that were playing the day you were born. After all,
you do have a special mystico-celestial relationship to them.
--Robert Keser
15627
From: Craig Keller
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 2:00am
Subject: Re: Re: Wise (Was:Rooftops)
>
> Tierney was his own auteur!
From http://www.noircity.com/typewriter-body.html -- by Eddie Muller --
==
...Banter about our respective Celtic ancestors drifted into
philosophical musings on the purpose, or pointlessness, of this
mortal coil. Then, just as I was warming up to the man, literally
letting my guard down, Tierney threw a short left hook toward my
chin.
I jerked my head back, assumed a protective pose, and eyed my new
pal suspiciously. "What the hell was that about?" I protested
querulously.
"Don't gesture at me like that," he growled, still holding out the left
like a threat. "People make fast moves around me, I react. I can't
help it." Tierney favored me with the slit-eyed glower that had
preceded many a barroom brawl. The moment passed. He slapped my
knee and cracked a conspiratorial smile: "Help me to the head,"
Tierney said, reaching for my arm. "I gotta take a piss before the
show."
I piloted Larry to the men's room, steered him to a urinal. Assisting
in this project was a delicate young gentleman named Darrell, whom
Tierney verbally abused throughout the arduous journey. We
positioned Tierney before the porcelain, maintaining a discreet
hold to stabilize his substantial bulk. An icebreaker was called
for at this awkward moment. "I don't mind walking with you, Larry,"
I offered, "but if you think I'm gonna take it out and hold it for
you, guess again." It was a calculated risk, trolling for some
bawdy Irish badinage we might share.
Tierney broke off a guffaw. He wrapped a mitt around my neck and jerked
me toward him. His bald dome banged my forehead. Despite the dull
ache this headbutt inspired, I took it as a sign of affection.
Real male bonding stuff.
As Tierney attended to his immediate priority, the restroom filled
up with rubberneckers. Word had spread that Tierney, the mad dog
himself, was in the head: not every day could you witness a micturating
movie star. Soon, the cognoscenti had formed a semi-circle around
the urinal. I signalled for them to grant some privacy. Legend or
not, this was a guy struggling to cope with an eighty year-old
bladder.
Not that Tierney needed my help. Zipping and pivoting, he squinted at
the assembled gawkers. "What are you guys," he roared, "a bunch of
fucking cocksuckers?" The throng tittered appreciatively. Better
than a mere piss, they were getting USDA Prime Tierney.
He bulled through the gaggle of fans, Darrell and I still lending
support. As we exited, who should enter but Robert Wise. Tierney
loomed over him. Wise looked as if he was staring into the eyes of
the Golem itself.
"Hello, Larry - how have you been?" the director chirped uneasily.
"Listen to me, Bob-" Tierney bellowed, reaching for the colorful cravat
Wise sported. "I'm directing you now! Get the fuck over here!"
Wise, dodging deftly for an octogenarian, slipped Tierney's clutches
and darted into the lavatory. "Good to see you Larry," he trailed
off.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15628
From: Damien Bona
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 2:58am
Subject: Re: History is made at night
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Adrian Martin wrote:
> Ah, dear friends, I turn 45 today! Any good 'turning 45' movies
anyone can
> recommend I should see?
>
> Adrian
Happy Birthday, Adrian!
Sadly, the movie you should watch is Mick Jackson's Chattahoochee,
because the character played by Gary Oldman, Emmett Foley, was
released from prison on September 15, 1959.
But a birthday should be celebrated by watching a film you love, or
seeing an upbeat one you hadn't viewed previously but are pretty sure
you'll love. My choice would be something by McCarey, Tashlin,
Minnelli or Edwards (and, as I love the Blondie movies, I might even
sneak in an Abby Berlin).
15629
From: samfilms2003
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:16am
Subject: Re: World Cinema and the recession
As you suggest, that interview & the one in Cineaste magazine.
I'm no insider !
-Sam
> > Also I know that Hou bought a Super 16 camera a year or two ago
> > (but I suspect he's thinking 3 X 2 hours......)
>
> Why are you suspecting this? Have you heard something, or are you
> thinking about the six-hour project he mentions at the beginning of the
> 'Millennium Mambo' interview? I thought he meant that 'Millennium
> Mambo' itself was going to be six-hours, but then he decided it was
> unrealistic for distribution so he pared the concept down to fit the
> average feature length.
>
> craig.
15630
From: Noel Vera
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:25am
Subject: Re: comic book movies (was: Anderson, Jost, Ozon, Ford, et al)
> I found the script too reliant on one-liners (though not half as
bad
> as the Schumacher outings) and found the story convoluted without
> necessity. The Penguin changes his plan from shot to shot,
> Christopher Walken's character seems largely unnecessary,a nd
> Catwoman's overall motivation - which SHOULD be to revenge herself
on
> Walken - is almost impossible to fathom.
>
> But still, better than the later films.
Oh, plot--can't take that seriously in a comic-book film. What I
like about BR is that the characters are so vivid, and develop as
the movie proceeds (De Vito's character is all about abandonment--he
was abandoned by his parents, then by the city, then by Walken, and
finally by his gang; when the penguins didn't abandon him, it was
actually rather moving); Pfieffer's character is all about trying to
have at least a coherent relationship with a man, and it turns out
she has one with her worse enemey.
I thought the one liners were the best part of the picture; they
tended to reveal character, they had rather unique speech patterns
from one freak to another, and what other comic-book movie has even
halfway decent dialogue (that's the disappointment with the Spidey
films--he's got one of the fastest mouths in the business, and
onscreen he manages maybe one or two witticism per fight sequence),
with as much nasty, oddball humor?
Walken doesn't make sense (again, the original screenplay clears
that up), I agree, but he's a nice little presence, nicely cynical.
15631
From: Elizabeth Nolan
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:39am
Subject: What did FIESCHI like and why?
What did FIESCHI like and why?
Elizabeth
> Cahiers had a Council of Ten critics that rated
> films from "No use bothering" to "Four stars." Fieschi proposed adding
> a sixth category for The Sound of Music, "Not to see under any
> pretext."
>
> I haven't seen The Sound of Music in about thirty years, so I remain
> neutral. Besides, Fieschi was critical of Sunrise, so he's clearly
> hard to please.
>
> Paul
>
15632
From: Noel Vera
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:39am
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
> --- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Dan Sallitt wrote:
> > > Many people claim
> > > that Taiwan, along with Iran, is now the center of film
culture.
> > > Taiwanese directors, including Yang, Hou and Tsai Ming-liang,
I liked Yi-yi well enough (the literal pronunciation would be "ee"-
"ee," as in "one-one," which is what the title literally means),
perhaps not as much as most critics. Thought Yang successfully gets
under the men's skins, and reveals their delusions and
vulnerabilities. The women, though, are more problematical.
I would agree, A Brighter Summer Day is his far stronger work.
Mahjong is just terrible, Tarantino without the snap pacing.
There used to be a laserdisc of City of Sadness, but it had so few
subtitles we could barely understand the film; I had to see it on 35
mm in the Cinemanila festival to realize how great it really was.
15633
From: Elizabeth Nolan
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:44am
Subject: Gangs of NY
> can still make money after the problems surrounding THE GANGS OF NEW
> YORK, by no means not one of his better films.
>
> Tony Williams
For me, the problem with GONY was the casting. DiCaprio never seemed
the revengeful type; his 'reformatory' time must have been in a place
like BOYS' TOWN with Father o'Malley as I would have expected him to be
a more hardened character. Someone named butcher with a penchant for
knife-throwing should have elicited a 'hanibal/cannibal response, but I
felt DDLewis was more of a caricature. Never felt any fearful respect
for him, just amusement, perhaps it was the old eagle eye.
15634
From: Paul Gallagher
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:24am
Subject: Re: What did FIESCHI like and why?
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Elizabeth Nolan wrote:
>
> What did FIESCHI like and why?
> Elizabeth
That's a good question. Jim Hillier quotes Fieschi: "There is not a
single major recent work which is not first and foremost in opposition
to its audience, and the past year bears witness to this fact by the
richness of misunderstood films it has offered us -- Muriel, Les
Carabiniers, Le Proces de Jeane d'Arc, The Exterminating Angel, even
Adieu Philippine....It may be that the broken engagement with the
audience will be made up some day , but it will not be made up with
compromise and flattery, at the cost of works themselves." This meant
increasingly turning away from Hollywood toward, in Fieschi words,
"current Italian, Polish, French, or Brazilian films." It meant as
well for Fieschi that only a relatively few directors were considered
to be auteurs. Many Hollywood directors, such as Preminger, Minnelli,
and Walsh, were devalued. On the other hand, Jacques Tourneur and Sirk
were rediscovered, and Wilder and Huston were reappraised.
Here's Fieschi's 10 best American films list from 1963.
1. Vertigo (Hitchcock)
2. Bringing Up Baby (Hawks)
3. Moonfleet (Lang)
4. The Searchers (Ford)
5. The Shanghai Gesture (Sternberg)
6. Duck Soup (McCarey)
The Miracle Worker (Penn)
Splendor in the Grass (Kazan)
9. Heaven Can Wait (Lubitsch)
10. The Quiet American (Mankewiecz)
15635
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:46am
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Fred Camper wrote:
>
Fred -- I don't dislike Yi Yi -- it's a perfectly ok film, but way
over-praised, IMO. I paid 9 bucks and saw it in a theatre, and I
dragged two friends to see it with me. Marvin in particular is a
total esthete who rarely fails to react to things like use of space
and architecture in films -- it's really what he lives for. And we
were all let down. In fact, as I recall, Marvin was the one who
started the Emperor's New Clothes rap as we entered the parking lot.
If I had just seen it, without the incredible buildup, I probably
wouldn't have been.
As for my polemical use of "hype," some of my best friends (including
me) practice it or have practiced it for a living. I have no problem
with hype, because without it cinema doesn't get made, doesn't get
seen, dies. But I do believe that every kind of film gets marketed in
its own way to its own audience, and critics -- however academic --
are part of that for films like Yi Yi. If you do a 10 Best List of
current releases, you are telling people not to miss those films.
Those who did that weren't being paid by Edward Yang to put his name
on the list, but the network of transactions that support even those
pure voices -- festival passes, airplane tickets, meals, hotel rooms
and press screenings, free cassettes and DVDs, books, gratifying
relationships with great artists and other perceived bigshots --
constitutes payment of a sort for just keeping the art film sector
going. And when overestimation reaches a fever pitch for films that
in five years will be forgotten, we're into the same kind of
groupthink that generates all those disposable blockbusters of
summer. In my opinion.
If we're going to tar our mainstream critical brethren with being
publicists in disguise -- as many an arthouse critic has done in
print in recent years -- we have to be ready for some of that to
spatter on us. I believe Jonathan dealt with this seeming paradox in
some of the interchapters of Politics of Vision, and the thread that
played out here on Auteurism in the Indy Marketplace a few days ago
takes the comparison in interesting new directions. My own prejudice
is against categorization: I think that what goes on on the H'wd and
arthouse sides of the Great Divide presents all sorts of mirror
relationships that I find more interesting than blanket condemnation
of one sub-industry or the other, which usually amounts to
scapegoating.
For the record, I did have dinner with Edward Yang once, and he
struck me as charming, handsome, slightly boring but perfectly
likeable. Like Yi Yi. I'll now make a point of seeing A Brighter
Summer Day, for my sins.
15636
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:49am
Subject: Fieschi
Jean-André Fieschi is a figure who really fascinates me. His lengthy review
of THE BIRDS in CAHIERS at the time of its French release must be one of the
first pieces of film criticism to apply Lacan!
In the early '70s, he formed a powerhouse critical-theoretical tag-team with
Noel Burch: I think they taught at the same institution. The fruit of this
period, writing-wise, is all in English in the Roud two-volume CRITICAL
DICTIONARY: absolutely superb essays on Straub-Huillet, Murnau, Bunuel,
Hitchcock, some others ... What Fieschi had over Burch in that phase was
more of a poetic/lyrical sense: it shines through in his prose, even in
translation.
By the end of the '70s Fieschi moved into video art and made some celebrated
pieces in that field, which I have never seen. Not much writing after that -
a trajectory similar to the equally brilliant Thierry Kuntzel.
Some A FILM BY cinephiles may not know that it was Fieschi who discovered
Jean Eustache's body after he had suicided on 5 November 1981. Legend has it
that Eustache had left his last piece of black humour in a note to Fieschi
on the front door: "Knock loudly to wake the dead". However, Evane Hanska's
jaw-dropping, tell-all book MES ANNEES EUSTACHE ("My Eustache Years" - and
what tormented years they were!) gives a less novelistic account of this
incident ... One of Fieschi's videos contains the final images taken of
Eustache, who had apparently become a strange, crippled Mabuse-like figure
by the end, never leaving his apartment. All sordid details are in Hanska's
book!
Fieschi tells Hanska in this book that he and Eustache once watched Lang's
MOONFLEET together: "A magnificent film, but Jean didn't like it, and I
realised that was because it scared him a lot. Jean didn't like the film
because it had many shots of the sea - and the sea didn't move the way he
wanted it to. I believe he could no longer tell the difference between
fiction and reality."
Adrian
15637
From: thebradstevens
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 1:14pm
Subject: Trying to contact L. M. Kit Carson
I'm currently researching a book about Jim McBride, in connection
with which I have been trying to contact L. M. Kit Carson. Does
anyone have any contact information?
15638
From: Fred Camper
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 2:02pm
Subject: Re: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
Bill,
First of all, it's absolutely not true that "cinema doesn't get made"
without "hype." You're talking about one kind of "cinema." To my mind,
cinema includes avant-garde films, documentary films, home movies, even
student films, and I hate it when "cinema" is used to mean only the sync
sound narrative feature.
Second of all, take a look at the definitions of "hype:" "Excessive
publicity and the ensuing commotion.... Exaggerated or extravagant
claims made especially in advertising or promotional material...." (from
http://www.bartleby.com/61/52/H0355200.html)
My point is that the critics you cite, certainly I'm sure about myself
and I'd bet long odds on Jonathan Rosenbaum and John Belton too, were
writing from authentic love of Yang's films and were writing in a way
that was true to their experience of those films and was not
"exaggerated.". Their experience of Yang was apparently different from
yours. (And by the way, Jonathan's praise of it was not all that
enormous; see
http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/19688_YI_YI) Thus they
weren't exaggerating anything, but writing from a different perception
of what the film was than yours. Of course I know you know that some
people find ordinary films that others find great.
Third, and most important, the most essential point about auteurism for
me is the way that seeing film B by a director can completely change
one's perception of film A, even to the point of making it seem like a
different film.
Fred Camper
15639
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 2:15pm
Subject: Re: Trying to contact L. M. Kit Carson
Call the Writers Guild and ask the Agency for contact
information. They should be able to give you the name
of his agent or representative and you can take it
from there.
Last time I saw Kit was in Dallas Texas at a party
thrown by the USA Film Festival. I was on the festival
jury with Todd Haynes.
--- thebradstevens wrote:
> I'm currently researching a book about Jim McBride,
> in connection
> with which I have been trying to contact L. M. Kit
> Carson. Does
> anyone have any contact information?
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage!
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
15640
From:
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:00pm
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
Thanks to everybody from their informative posts on Edward Yang.
I certainly DO greatly respect Jonathan Rosenbaum, Fred Camper and John Belton as critics. And read carefully what they write about cinema. I have learned a huge amount from all three, and will continue to do so in the future.
I also disassociated their, and other critics', critical writings from the word "hype" in my previous post. Hype refers to advertising and publicity, not criticism.
Critical articles on Yang can be found at:
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/filmdirectors/Yang-Zinnemann.htm
They document his huge critical prestige.
Trying to understand Yang is not an easy task. His films are badly distributed. "A Brighter Summer Day" is the archetypal much-praised-but-impossible-to-see art film. Until this distribution situation changes, most people's (and my) ideas about Yang will be extremely fuzzy.
Nike Grost
15641
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:13pm
Subject: Re: Fieschi
--- Adrian Martin wrote:
One of Fieschi's videos contains the
> final images taken of
> Eustache, who had apparently become a strange,
> crippled Mabuse-like figure
> by the end, never leaving his apartment. All sordid
> details are in Hanska's
> book!
>
When did the book come out/ Is it still gnerally
available?
I recall that in an interview Garrel, part of a whole
generation deeply moved by "The Mother and the Whore"
spoke of Eustache's death as "a warning."
> Fieschi tells Hanska in this book that he and
> Eustache once watched Lang's
> MOONFLEET together: "A magnificent film, but Jean
> didn't like it, and I
> realised that was because it scared him a lot. Jean
> didn't like the film
> because it had many shots of the sea - and the sea
> didn't move the way he
> wanted it to. I believe he could no longer tell the
> difference between
> fiction and reality."
>
This is fascinating in light of the shots of the sea
in Lewin's "Pandora and the Flying Dutchman" that are
shown in "Mes Petites Amoureuses."
Eustache has always struck me as a kind of failed
neo-fascist dandy -- a variation on the character
played by Maurice Ronet in "Le Feu Follet."
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Y! Messenger - Communicate in real time. Download now.
http://messenger.yahoo.com
15642
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:34pm
Subject: Re: Cinema and Hype,ex-Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Fred Camper wrote:
> Bill,
>
> First of all, it's absolutely not true that "cinema doesn't get
made"
> without "hype." You're talking about one kind of "cinema." To my
mind,
> cinema includes avant-garde films, documentary films, home movies,
even
> student films, and I hate it when "cinema" is used to mean only the
sync
> sound narrative feature.
>
> Second of all, take a look at the definitions of "hype:" "Excessive
> publicity and the ensuing commotion.... Exaggerated or extravagant
> claims made especially in advertising or promotional material...."
(from
> http://www.bartleby.com/61/52/H0355200.html)
>
> My point is that the critics you cite, certainly I'm sure about
myself
> and I'd bet long odds on Jonathan Rosenbaum and John Belton too,
were
> writing from authentic love of Yang's films and were writing in a
way
> that was true to their experience of those films and was not
> "exaggerated.". Their experience of Yang was apparently different
from
> yours. (And by the way, Jonathan's praise of it was not all that
> enormous; see
> http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/19688_YI_YI) Thus
they
> weren't exaggerating anything, but writing from a different
perception
> of what the film was than yours. Of course I know you know that
some
> people find ordinary films that others find great.
>
> Third, and most important, the most essential point about auteurism
for
> me is the way that seeing film B by a director can completely
change
> one's perception of film A, even to the point of making it seem
like a
> different film.
>
> Fred Camper
Actually, it was Mike who started listing critics, not me. Points in
response to your post:
1. "Hype" is used these days to mean "publicity and promotion" --
hence my use of the standard expression " in my innocent initial post
responding to Kevin, who brought up Yang re: It's Pat -- but let's
substitute "publicity and promotion."
2. Without publicity and promotion to reach their audience, no H'wd
film and no art film would be made. I'll stand by that. A film that
costs in the millions or tens of thousands of dollars needs to be
distributed and publicized, or the next film by the same person won't
happen: ie will not be financed. Only hvies (but not documentaries,
like the two superb ones I saw last night: Bush's Brain and Farenheit
9/11) would be possible publicity and promotion. Grant me that I
usually go out of my way to respect these distinctions of
terminology -- I gjust wanted to get polemical in my last post (cf.
6).
3. When I started my aborted investigation of the American avant-
garde for Serge Daney -- who didn't really want it, it turned out --
my first instinct (the mirror effect I alluded to) was to look at how
avant-garde films are financed, publicized and promoted. At the time
the questions I raised in my last post were being widely discussed by
the avant-garde filmmakers I talked to -- unknowns I met at Buffalo
SUNY, but also people like Paul Sharits. I can't say that I took it
far enough to know the answer, esp. today, but you do: Would avant-
garde films get made without publicity and promotion to insure that
they are seen by their intended audience?
4. I worked in a PR department for nine years, and I can assure you:
the people who marketed, say, Cocoon, REALLY LOVED COCOON! There's
nothing wrong with that, and there's nothing wrong with critics who
help publicize and promote art films doing the same thing for art
films. Ditto avant-garde films. It becomes a more and more thankless
task the lower the average budget of the type of film we're talking
about, and my hat is off to people who do it for so little reward.
5. Over-praising is not a good thing, because people stop trusting
the messenger if it happens too often.
6. When I translated "all films but home movies would not get made if
publicity and promotion didn't keep bringing money -- or the
equivalent of money for avant-garde work -- back in to make them"
into "cinema would die without hype," I was being polemical by
connecting a beloved a_film_by word to a hated a_film_by word,
because I wanted a discussion. Thanks for your response.
15643
From: Jonathan Rosenbaum
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:37pm
Subject: A Brighter Summerf Day
> Mike is also right that understanding Yang should begin with the
> magnificent "A Brighter Summer Day."
Just a quick note from a Toronto cybercafe, for members of "a film by" who
despair of ever seeing this film. An English subtitled VCD of the film is
available (a simple kind of DVD without chapters, playable on most DVD
players), or at least it was a couple of years ago, and I managed to order one
on the Internet.
15644
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:38pm
Subject: Re: Trying to contact L. M. Kit Carson
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, David Ehrenstein
wrote:
> Call the Writers Guild and ask the Agency for contact
> information. They should be able to give you the name
> of his agent or representative and you can take it
> from there.
>
> Last time I saw Kit was in Dallas Texas at a party
> thrown by the USA Film Festival. I was on the festival
> jury with Todd Haynes.
>
> --- thebradstevens wrote:
>
> > I'm currently researching a book about Jim McBride,
> > in connection
> > with which I have been trying to contact L. M. Kit
> > Carson. Does
> > anyone have any contact information?
I saw him in San Francisco w. Tom Luddy. He had been helping with CQ.
Get the number for American Zoetrope from information (San Francisco)
and call Tom there -- if Telluride isn't still happening, he should
be back in the office.
15645
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:57pm
Subject: Re: Cinema and Hype, re-post
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
Let me just re-post this -- my mouse has become hyperactive (huh-huh):
Actually, it was Mike who started listing critics, not me. Points in
response to your post:
1. "Hype" is used these days to mean "publicity and promotion" --
hence my use of the standard expression "over-hyped" in my innocent
initial postresponding to Kevin, who brought up Yang re: It's Pat --
but let's substitute "publicity and promotion."
2. Without publicity and promotion to reach their audience, no H'wd
film and no art film would be made. I'll stand by that. A film that
costs in the millions or tens of thousands of dollars needs to be
distributed and publicized, or the next film by the same person won't
happen: ie will not be financed. Only home movies (but not
documentaries, like the two superb ones I saw last night: Bush's
Brain and Farenheit 9/11) would be possible publicity and promotion.
Grant me that I usually go out of my way to respect these
distinctions of terminology -- I just wanted to get polemical in my
last post (cf.6).
3. When I started my aborted investigation of the American avant-
garde for Serge Daney -- who didn't really want it, it turned out --
my first instinct (the mirror effect I alluded to) was to look at how
avant-garde films are financed, publicized and promoted. At the time
the questions I raised in my last post were being widely discussed by
the avant-garde filmmakers I talked to -- unknowns I met at Buffalo
SUNY, but also people like Paul Sharits. I can't say that I took it
far enough to know the answer, esp. today, but you do: Would avant-
garde films get made without publicity and promotion to insure that
they are seen by their intended audience?
4. I worked in a PR department for nine years, and I can assure you:
the people who marketed, say, Cocoon, REALLY LOVED COCOON! There's
nothing wrong with that, and there's nothing wrong with critics who
help publicize and promote art films doing the same thing for art
films. Ditto avant-garde films. It becomes a more and more thankless
task the lower the average budget of the type of film we're talking
about, and my hat is off to people who do it for so little reward.
5. Over-praising is not a good thing, because people stop trusting
the messenger if it happens too often.
6. When I translated "all films but home movies would not get made if
publicity and promotion didn't keep bringing money -- or the
equivalent of money for avant-garde work -- back in to make them"
into "cinema would die without hype," I was being polemical by
connecting a beloved a_film_by word to a hated a_film_by word,
because I wanted a discussion. Thanks for your response.
15646
From: Zach Campbell
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:17pm
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summerf Day
Jonathan Rosenbaum:
> An English subtitled VCD of the film is available (a simple kind
> of DVD without chapters, playable on most DVD players), or at
> least it was a couple of years ago, and I managed to order one
> on the Internet.
Using Google, it looks like you can still pick it up here and there
online. I bought a copy a few years ago that I've had sitting
around forever, largely because putting aside four ideally
uninterrupted hours for home viewing is both daunting and
difficult. But I've gone too long without seeing this film, so
maybe I just need to get up early one weekend morning, make the
coffee, and jump in.
I'm curious if A BRIGHTER SUMMER DAY has a natural intermission
midway through?
--Zach
15647
From: Zach Campbell
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:43pm
Subject: Re: It's Pat, Legally Blonde
Kevin J.:
> As for Legally Blonde, I guess I'm just a sucker for girl culture.
> You have to really care about these denigrated markers of
> femininity for the film to work, I imagine. Overall, Elle has
> access to a knowledge that America's patriarchal legal process
> devalues.
Hmm. My impression is that the film is imagining an ideal audience
of girls and women of the "postfeminist" generation, ones who take
career ambition and girl culture as birthrights. Maybe you more or
less agree with this, and are more optimistic than I am about its
implications? I guess I just find myself largely uncomfortable
with "girl culture," at least in the way its presented here and in
other movies--it strikes me as restrictive instead of liberating no
matter how empowered or empowering it becomes. Maybe this is one
reason why I get such a kick out of DROP DEAD GORGEOUS, which
punctures many aspects of girl culture (and so many other cultural
articulations).
> And again, she disses Aristotle. Aristotle!! That takes some
> cojones or the female equivalent thereof (see? Elle would have a
> field day unpacking my patriarchal language).
Maybe if it were called HISTORICALLY BLONDE and she were a female
scholar in a twelfth century European university, in which case
dissing Aristotle would be hardcore. Alternate title in case she
gets burned at the stake by Luke Wilson in the final scene: THE
PASSION OF ELLE.
By the way, I skipped IT'S PAT for now but did rent another Kevin-
favorite, EMPIRE RECORDS. I had some substantial reservations about
the film--but liked it overall, and the final extended sequence is
certainly a highlight of teen film. (Still, my heart belongs to
something like CAN'T HARDLY WAIT.)
And speaking of teen films and issues of feminism, how do people
feel about BRING IT ON, which Robin Wood also seems to like a lot
even though he slept through much of his first viewing (according to
a recent Cineaction letters section)?
--Zach
15648
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 3:53pm
Subject: Re: Cinema and Hype,: Erratum
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "hotlove666"
wrote:
The expression I used in my early post was "over-hyped." My mouse
blithely erased it.
15649
From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 5:04pm
Subject: Apache Drums (Was: Rooftops)
> I recently saw APACHE DRUMS and thought it excellent - the direction
> by Hugo Fregonese lacks imagination, but the script and atmosphere
> are just great. It has a surprising amount in common with Lewton's
> horrors, and reaches for almost supernatural effects at times.
I really like this film *and* Fregonese's direction. I may have already
related by experience of watching a Mankiewicz film and Fregonese film
back to back, and realizing that some directors (Mankiewicz) make every
image redundant by turning it into a (usually uninteresting) idea, whereas
others (Fregonese) give every image autonomy and integrity without even
trying. - Dan
15650
From: Jonathan Takagi
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 5:11pm
Subject: RE: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
> I would agree, A Brighter Summer Day is his far stronger work.
> Mahjong is just terrible, Tarantino without the snap pacing.
I must be one of the very few people around who actually
likes "Mahjong". Everyone tells me the acting (especially
the British guy) is horrible, but it seems passable to my
untrained eye. I find the love story convincing enough and
even (at the end) touching. I'm not sure how it could be
compared to Tarantino, do you mean thematically? The boys
are all novice/amateur crooks.
There's a decent laserdisc version of "A Brighter Summer
Day" which is easily obtainable. Again, if you don't
mind a LD -> DVD-R/VHS copy, email me off list.
Jonathan Takagi
15651
From: Craig Keller
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:01pm
Subject: What Filmmakers "Can" and "Can't" Do
In line with the conversation about certain filmmakers feeling able or
unable to continuing doing work, check out this excerpt from the
"Boldfaced Names" social-circuit column in today's NY Times, about the
private soirée at the Guggenheim held for the re-release of 'THX-1136.'
(The whole article can be read here:
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/16/nyregion/16bold.html )
===
Despite the fact that Mr. Lucas has spent the 30-plus years since "THX"
working on projects with a decidedly commercial ring (a vintage Boba
Fett is probably waiting right now on eBay), he said he felt his first
film was more reflective of his personality.
"That's the real me," said Mr. Lucas, who these days looks like a cross
between Kenny Rogers and Michael McDonald.
"For years, I've been doing the pretend me,'' Mr. Lucas said. "I've
been successful at it. But my true nature is really "THX" and that's
the kind of movie I thought I was going to be making the rest of my
life and that I wanted to make and just never - I got sidetracked with
all these opportunities. I just sort of got trapped into this thing,
which I enjoyed doing a lot, but it's not completely reflective of what
I like to do. I never thought I'd get stuck doing kids' films for the
rest of my life."
===
"Stuck," says one of the two wealthiest independent filmmakers in
America, who is able to self-actualize all his pictures!! And just
last week I heard he is in fact in the planning stages for 'Star Wars
Episodes VII to XI'!
craig.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15652
From: Travis Miles
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:00pm
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summerf Day
I saw Edward Yang speak in London about a year and a half ago at the
Institute of Contemporary Art. He seemed a remarkably pragmatic and
anti-formalist thinker, indicated that he operated largely by intuition
during shooting, despite the extraordinarily precise rhythms of his
architectural montage. One response I remember, "Oh yeah, glass walls, I
suppose there's a lot of that in my films." I think he was less disingenuous
than jet-lagged.
Anyway, the point of all this is that I asked him briefly about the
distribution problems with Mahjong and A Confucian Confusion (which had been
absent from two London "retrospectives"), as well as the general DVD release
of many of his films. He seemed very despairing about any prospect of an
impending edition of his films, adding that his films did not seem like the
kind of properties that inherently demanded the resolution of problems
regarding their invisibility. Rather defeatist, but again, I hope it was
just the jet lag.
I agree with many other list members that A Brighter Summer Day is Yang No.
1, but would argue that Taipei Story is a hugely impressive work and more
indicative of the strange brew that was New Taiwanese Cinema in its heyday.
Anybody gagging to see this film, as gag you should, is free to contact me
off-list.
T
On 9/16/04 11:37 AM, "Jonathan Rosenbaum" wrote:
>
>
>> Mike is also right that understanding Yang should begin with the
>> magnificent "A Brighter Summer Day."
>
> Just a quick note from a Toronto cybercafe, for members of "a film by" who
> despair of ever seeing this film. An English subtitled VCD of the film is
> available (a simple kind of DVD without chapters, playable on most DVD
> players), or at least it was a couple of years ago, and I managed to order one
> on the Internet.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
15653
From: Craig Keller
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:06pm
Subject: correction
> in the planning stages for 'Star Wars
> Episodes VII to XI'!
err, that is, episodes VII to -IX-. It's too early in the day to be
Roman.
craig.
15654
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:22pm
Subject: Re: What Filmmakers "Can" and "Can't" Do
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Craig Keller
wrote:
And just
> last week I heard he is in fact in the planning stages for 'Star
Wars
> Episodes VII to XI'!
>
Bitchun!
15655
From: Travis Miles
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:20pm
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summers Day II
And while we're on the subject, do any of you know the story behind the
three hour "condensed" version of ABSD that was released in the UK? I have
seen it twice, and the four hour version twice, and while the longer is
certainly the greater, the other version still packs a wallop. The odd thing
is, it seems that the condensing was on the order of tightening longer set
pieces rather than excising whole chunks, so that in some ways it's hard to
tell the difference.
Anybody seen the 3 hour version in the US?
It's all rather mysterious...
T
15656
From: thebradstevens
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:37pm
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summers Day II
"Anybody seen the 3 hour version in the US?"
Both versions have played on Film Four in the UK. The annoying thing
is that the English subtitles on the four-hour version are pretty
inadequate, so that, for example, it is impossible to understand the
relevance of the radio broadcast in the final scene.
15657
From: iangjohnston
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 6:36pm
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summerf Day
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Travis Miles
wrote:
> I agree with many other list members that A Brighter Summer Day is
Yang No.
> 1, but would argue that Taipei Story is a hugely impressive work
and more
> indicative of the strange brew that was New Taiwanese Cinema in
its heyday.
I'd agree with the praise here for Taipei Story (which has the added
interest of an acting performance by Hou Hsiao-Hsien). I was very
impressed, too, by The Terroriser when I first saw it. A Brighter
Summer's Day is, as everyone says, the Yang masterpiece; still,
don't forget the lighter, more comic, beautiful gem that A Confucian
Confusion is. (But I did find Mahjong pretty unwatchable and Yi Yi,
though still very good, a little disappointing. But I'd rather
critics "hype" Yi Yi than the likes of Adaptation...)
15658
From: cairnsdavid1967
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 7:25pm
Subject: Re: Gangs of NY
> For me, the problem with GONY was the casting. DiCaprio never
seemed
> the revengeful type;
It doesn't help that he has no strong Hamlet-style motivation for
failing to get his revenge at the earliest opportunity. With the
revenge motor stalled, the film just idles along. So Leo's part is
unplayable.
Then Bill has every reason to kill Leo but doesn't, settling for a
botched mutilation that's healed up twenty minutes of screen time
later. At least Bill has a self-destructive side so you can gues she
might have had reason to leave his enemy alive. But the reason he
doesn't terrify too much is also plot-based: he never kills anyone
substantial or competent, exchept possibly Liam Neeson in the
opening. When the mayoral candidate turns his bacon Bill and allows
himself to be stabbed, like an idiot, we lose respect for him. And if
Bill doesn't have worthwhile opponents, he loses stature.
Scorsese is one director strong enough to overcome casting problems -
but not dramatic flaws in his script.
I still enjoyed the film, but it was the incidental characters and
details that gave me pleasure, not the central characters and plot.
15659
From: cairnsdavid1967
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 7:29pm
Subject: Re: Apache Drums (Was: Rooftops)
> I really like this film *and* Fregonese's direction. I may have
already
> related by experience of watching a Mankiewicz film and Fregonese
film
> back to back, and realizing that some directors (Mankiewicz) make
every
> image redundant by turning it into a (usually uninteresting) idea,
whereas
> others (Fregonese) give every image autonomy and integrity without
even
> trying. - Dan
Would still rather watch a good Mankiewicz! I think the thing that
put me off Fregonese' treatment of AD was the first shot of an
Apache - they receive a great build-up in the story, especially from
Clarence Muse' dying description of their attack - then Freg presents
an entirely matter-of-fact shot of an Indian, assuming we've all seen
one before and that this isn't a dramatic moment - but forgetting
that we've never seen one in THIS film, and we've been lead to expect
somethig terrifying. I just know Tourneur would've had the brave
emerging from shadows or something.
Apart from that I certainly found HF's direction competent, with a
few impressive shock moments - including a great Lewtonesque door
that swings open to reveal - !
15660
From: cairnsdavid1967
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 7:43pm
Subject: Re: comic book movies (was: Anderson, Jost, Ozon, Ford, et al)
> Oh, plot--can't take that seriously in a comic-book film.
That's letting 'em off too easy. Most comic books hang together far
better than the movie adaptations. And SUPERMAN II makes sense, the
motivations are clear. The science in SPIDEY is inadequate even for a
comic, but the character logic is sound.
> What I
> like about BR is that the characters are so vivid,
"Luird is more like it," as Robert Stephens says in THE PRIVATE LIFE
OF SHERLOCK HOLMES. But I like their luridness, and DeVito's
performance is especially fine.
> I thought the one liners were the best part of the picture; they
> tended to reveal character, they had rather unique speech patterns
> from one freak to another, and what other comic-book movie has even
> halfway decent dialogue (that's the disappointment with the Spidey
> films--he's got one of the fastest mouths in the business, and
> onscreen he manages maybe one or two witticism per fight sequence),
> with as much nasty, oddball humor?
The first three SUPERMAN films managed to make Superman both sweet
and funny, no mean feat, and did OK by the supporting casts. Not
outstanding, but never bad. HELLBOY is good. Atmospheric weirdness
from the baddies, wisecracks from HELLBOY. X-MEN has some great
lines. If you want a one-liner that encapsulates character,
Wolverine's "You're a dick" can't be beat!
> Walken doesn't make sense (again, the original screenplay clears
> that up), I agree, but he's a nice little presence, nicely cynical.
I wil lhave a look at the screenplay as I'm curious as to what his
role is. It's always nice to see him, but I didn't like the feeling
of having him SERVED UP to me for no reason. Also didn't like the way
he disappears from TRUE ROMANCE. Filmmakers, you gotta GET THE MOST
from your Walken!
15661
From: hotlove666
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 8:10pm
Subject: Walken (Was: comic book movies (was: Anderson, Jost, Ozon, Ford, et al)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "cairnsdavid1967"
wrote:
>
> > Walken doesn't make sense (again, the original screenplay
clears
> > that up), I agree, but he's a nice little presence, nicely cynical.
>
> I wil lhave a look at the screenplay as I'm curious as to what
his
> role is. It's always nice to see him, but I didn't like the feeling
> of having him SERVED UP to me for no reason. Also didn't like
the way
> he disappears from TRUE ROMANCE. Filmmakers, you gotta
GET THE MOST
> from your Walken!
Cinefile has a great short by someone called the Christopher
Walken Academy for Actors, where a heavily made-up and
prostheticized actor playing Walken beats a student to a pulp
while "teaching" him. Great end credit song (sung "by" Walken) :
"Everybody's Talkin' Like Christopher Walken!"
I understand from habelove that in his touted performance in the
NY production of The Dead he made no attempt to assume the
character or an accent. He played it just like he played the guy in
the wheelchair in Things To Do In Denver...
15662
From: Brandon
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 0:23am
Subject: Re: A Brighter Summer Day
>Just a quick note from a Toronto cybercafe, for members of "a film by" who
>despair of ever seeing this film. An English subtitled VCD of the film is
>available (a simple kind of DVD without chapters, playable on most DVD
>players), or at least it was a couple of years ago, and I managed to order
>one
>on the Internet.
You can also get a 2xDVD of "A Brighter Summer Day" from
www.superhappyfun.com, a reliable bootleg site. The version they sell has
non-removable English and (Chinese?) subtitles, and fairly good picture
quality (comparable to VHS). It's about 3:48 in length. Plays fine on my
computer, but locks up on my CyberHome 500 DVD player. I can't test it in
the good Panasonic player right now, because it is raining in my living room.
15663
From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 1:15am
Subject: Lathan (Was: Rooftops)
> really the finest film of this whole bunch, Stan Lathan's BEAT STREET
> (1984), which recently came out on DVD. A surprisingly political film of its
> kind. I know Lathan did a noted youth-culture doco before this; did he ever
> do anything since?
Right after BEAT STREET, he had a fairly prestigious project, an
adaptation of James Baldwin's GO TELL IT ON THE MOUNTAIN that played
festivals. I can't say I was wild about it. I guess he headed off into
TV after that. - Dan
15664
From:
Date: Thu Sep 16, 2004 9:53pm
Subject: Re: Re: It's Pat, Legally Blonde
In a message dated 9/16/04 11:45:20 AM, rashomon82@y... writes:
> I guess I just find myself largely uncomfortable with "girl culture," at
> least in the way its presented here and in other movies--it strikes me as
> restrictive instead of liberating no matter how empowered or empowering it
> becomes.
>
Yes, but to paraphrase the great Tania Modleski off the top of my head,
patriarchy restricts women to certain areas of culture (eg. fashion) and then
ridicules them for occupying that space. We have to imagine that perm solution and
pink pill-box hats are at least as worthy of praise, sustained critical
attetion, being film subjects, etc. as, oh, photography or sport (if one can't
already imagine it, that is).
Glad you enjoyed Empire Records. It needs friends.
And I loved Bring It On. The race issues are skin-deep, natch, but the first
45 minutes or so are a veritable model of how to throw non-stop sucker punches
to an audience. Exhilaration! I'm still looking for a pristine MP3 of that
first song/cheer ("I swear I'm not a whore!"). But Down With Love cuts it
overall, making up for a slight loss of energy with Lubitschian editing and some
extraordinarly moving meditations on a life lived in quotes and subtexts.
Kevin John
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15665
From: Jonathan Rosenbaum
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 2:54am
Subject: Re: Fieschi
>
> Eustache has always struck me as a kind of failed
> neo-fascist dandy -- a variation on the character
> played by Maurice Ronet in "Le Feu Follet."
Maybe, but the class orientation might be quite different. Eustache
was very much a member of the working-class--and LE COCHON, his most
neglected work, could never have been made by a Malle.
15666
From: Dan Sallitt
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 2:56am
Subject: Eustache (Was: Fieschi)
> One of Fieschi's videos contains the final images taken of
> Eustache, who had apparently become a strange, crippled Mabuse-like figure
> by the end, never leaving his apartment.
I believe he was crippled from his previous suicide attempt, so it all
fits together. - Dan
15667
From: Fred Camper
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:12am
Subject: Philippine cinema
Our group recently gained its second (as far as I know; not everyone
tells us their country) Filipino member, Alexis Tioseco, and he and I
exchanged an email or two about Philippine cinema. His reply to mine I
thought was worth posting to the group, and with his permission I'm
doing that. Perhaps others have seen and wish to comment on some of the
films he recomends. His writing, and information on Philippine cinema,
can be found at http://www.film.indiefilipino.com .
Fred Camper
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Philippine cinema
Resent-Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2004 23:05:29 -0500
Resent-From: f@f...
Resent-To: fc@f...
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 2004 21:08:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alexis Tioseco
To: Fred Camper
Dear Fred,
Sorry for the delayed reply.
That's great that you have gotten to see a few Lino
Brocka films, as well as 'Perfumed Nightmare'. Just
the other day I watched a copy of Lino Brocka's
classic film "Maynila sa mga Kuko ng Liwanag" (Manila
in the Claws of Neon). It's a great episodic account
of the harrowing effect Manila (and the urban dream)
can have on the innocent, rural, filipino. It's also
an indictment of society (the Ferdinand Marcos ruled
martial law), and one of the best visual portraits of
Manila ever captured on celluloid. The cinematography
of the film was by Mike De Leon (one of only two or
three films he did cinematography for, other than his
own), who later became a filmmaker himself and is
considered one of the best and most intellectual
Filipino directors. He directed such classic films as
"Kisapamata" (In the Blink of an Eye), "Batch '81"
(Class of '81), and "Bayaning 3rd World" (Third World
Hero), among a crop of only works... all brilliant in
different ways.
"Perfumed Nightmare" is another one of my favourite
Filipino films. Kidlat's other strong full length
work is "Turumba", a film which is less experimental
but more focused than "Perfumed Nightmare". Noel
prefers Turmba while I think I like the raw charm of
the filmmaking in Perfumed Nightmare.
In regard to super 8mm films... I only recently
chanced on some VHS copies of old short films done by
filmmaker Raymond Red, who won the Palme D'or for best
short film in 2000 for his 35mm short "Anino". Anino
is likely his most polished work in term of its
aesthetics, and I enjoy it for its improvisational
feel and cinematography, but his previous shorts are
much more imaginative, more alive with ideas, and I
think I enjoy them more. Specifically "Ang Hikab",
and the studies (which can work as short films
themselves) for the feature length films he wants to
make "A Study for the Skies", about a filipino trying,
and failing, to invent a flying machine, and
"Makapili" (Traitor), about film about Filipino's that
collaborated with the Japanese during WW2, ratting our
revolutionaries. Makapili, shot in super 8mm,
expressionistic silent film style, is, in my opinion,
one of his best works, and would make not only a great
feature in terms of its style and filmmaking, but its
importance to our national history. Unfortunately,
even with Palme D'or in hand, he's had little luck in
getting funding for it. He has said that in order to
film it with production value at a believeable enough
level so as not to be distracting he would need 50
Million pesos (or close to 1 Million dollars). A
gastronomical budget in terms of Filipino productions.
We can only wait and see...
A few other filmmakers to remember are:
Lav Diaz, whose previous 5-hour work "Batang West
Side" (West Side Kid) won best film in Brussels and
Singapore International Film Festivals, and whose new
film is near completion, and will be premiering in
Toronto September 17 and 18. It is a sprawling
10-hour work set during the period of Martial Law in
the Philippines, shot in 16mm and digital, and
entirely in black and white. These two fims are the
ones that I would most recommend to you for trying to
have shown in Chicago.
Other names I'll mention briefly are
experimental/avant garde video filmmaker (it's a
contradiction, I know) Khavn De La Cruz, and 24 year
old Quark Henares, who has directed 2 commercial
features, one of which, KEKA (title character name) I
admire quite much.
There are a number of other interesting short
filmmakers, but I think I've already given you an
e-mail full.
Yours,
Alexis
15668
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:56am
Subject: Re: Fieschi
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan Rosenbaum"
wrote:
>
> >
> > Eustache has always struck me as a kind of failed
> > neo-fascist dandy -- a variation on the character
> > played by Maurice Ronet in "Le Feu Follet."
>
> Maybe, but the class orientation might be quite different. Eustache
> was very much a member of the working-class--and LE COCHON, his
most
> neglected work, could never have been made by a Malle.
Eustache was called all sorts of names when LMELP opened in
the "after-May" period, and the CdC didn't do justice to it till much
later -- I prefer the late Alain Phillipon's account in his Edirions
des Cahiers Eustache book to Bonitzer's article at the time, which
lumped it together with films like La grande bouffe (made, of course,
by an Italian communist). Phillipon, sadly, committed suicide too. My
favorite Eustache is the disastrous follow-up to the imperishable
Maman, Mes petites amoureuses.
Eustache exercises much more influence today than Godard over the
post-Pialat generation in France: Despleschin et al. A dandy? For
sure. (Failed) neo-fascist, I don't think so. But there were
certainly others who thought so at the height of his brief glory. I
would dearly love to resee and discover the whole oeuvre so we could
hash it out over espressos, but despite the impassioned support of
Catherine Veret of Unifrance, very little has been subtitled and
shown here. I saw Mes petites amoureuses once at the Nuart. It has
never been back.
15669
From: Fred Camper
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:24am
Subject: Re: Re: Cinema and Hype, re-post
Bill, sorry for my confusion about who posted what. I take your point
about the importance of publicity and promotion for films that have
significant, even if small, budgets. I think a few would still get made
if there were no publicity and promotion -- didn't one or the daughters
of the crooks who ran Adelphia make a $3 million feature, and someone
recently cited that little known director Prince Sihanouk, the regent of
Cambodia in the 1960s who had his whole country at his disposal (a
casting director's dream, presumably, even if his royal status didn't
also come with droit du seigneur) -- but by and large you're right.
Also, publicity and promotion surely has an influence not only on what
films get made but on the specifics of the ones that do get made. A hit
with a male and female star who have generated chemistry might lead to
another with the same duo; in the 50s that would be advertised as
"together again." Probably there's a history to be written, if it hasn't
been already, about the way that envisioned promotional possibilities
influenced script and casting and even plotting decisions.
About avant-garde film, of course questions of publicity and promotion
have been discussed over the decades. They are still being discussed
today, in places like FrameWorks, an email list on the subject of
avant-garde film. But just because they are being discussed doesn't mean
that many films would not be made without them.
From 1939, when Harry Smith was making his first hand painted films,
until the early 1960s, there were very few places anywhere where such
films could be shown. There were virtually no teaching jobs for such
filmmakers either. Income possibilities for this activity were about
zero. By the early 60s momentum was just starting to build, but even
then, I doubt avant-garde films were being screened at all in more than
ten or so U.S. cities. The screenings were in small locales and the
revenue generated negligible. "Promotion and publicity" would have done
little good. And one of the early "successes," "Scorpio Rising," built a
formidable underground reputation without any promotion.
The first showing of the MIT Film Society, which I co founded, occurred
in October 1965. It included as its centerpiece Kenneth Anger's "Scorpio
Rising," which had never been shown in the Boston area before to my
knowledge. We didn't know what we were doing (don't even ask about our
horrible projection), and the publicity was very minimal. I can't even
remember if I got a real poster out, but if so, it would have been put
up only shortly before the show. Four hundred and fifty people showed
up, a number of them on motorcycles, a number from other states; we had
to add a second show because the auditorium only seated 300. This was,
of course, a time when this kind of cinema was under-shown, and reputed
also to be rather risqué (remember you could not legally show full
nudity then, never mind sex acts), and I'm sure all this was a factor.
But I'm really digressing from the main point, which is whether the
films would have been made without publicity and promotion. The fact is,
for the first two and a half decades, they *were* made not only without
publicity and promotion but without much of an audience.
Why?
Now I'll get up on my favorite soap box, though I'll be repeating things
others have heard me say before.
A young poet once sent his poems to the great Rainer Maria Rilke, asking
advice, as he had done with editors as well. Rilke wrote back that he
was going about pursuing poetry in exactly the wrong way:
"You are looking outside, and that is what you should most avoid right
now. No one can advise or help you - no one. There is only one thing you
should do. Go into yourself. Find out the reason that commands you to
write; see whether it has spread its roots into the very depths of your
heart; confess to yourself whether you would have to die if you were
forbidden to write. This most of all: ask yourself in the most silent
hour of your night: must I write?"
(http://www.sfgoth.com/~immanis/rilke/letter1.html ; all ten letters are
on this page.)
This model of art making that Rilke describes has been common in the
Western high art tradition beginning at least with Romanticism, and also
has many antecedents and many examples in other cultures (see the ending
of Mizoguchi's "Utamaro and His Five Women" for a related version).
This model works for avant-garde film (and video) because at least for
people with the means of the "average" American these can be entirely
self-financed, the same way a painter who sells nothing pays for his own
materials and paints because he loves to. The budgets of many of the
early masterpieces would have been less than $100.
Brakhage once said something like, "When I started reading Freud, the
first thing I understood was, 'Here is a man trying to save his own
life.'" I like this view of Freud very much, not that I don't think he
has other relevance too, but if you see Freud this way, he becomes the
artist-explorer of his own psyche, and you don't have to worry about
whether he wasn't in fact very wrong about penis envy and all that.
A year or two before he died, I asked Brakhage about something I'd long
suspected: "Weren't you also talking about yourself as a filmmaker; that
is, weren't you making films in an attempt to save your own life." He
replied, "Yes." But I didn't really have to ask; if you view the
progression of his work from "Anticipation of the Night" onward you can
figure that out for yourself.
Kenneth Anger made "Fireworks" at 17. He could hardly show it anywhere.
A rather salacious bio of him, which he refutes, suggests that he used
it to whack off to. I think if you look at "Fireworks," that does sound
plausible. Perhaps that's even part of why he made it. This "use'
doesn't prevent it from also being a great work of art, of course.
The whole history of fine art is filled with painters and poets and
composers whose work got no recognition in their lifetimes but who are
considered among the greats today. Whatever differences there may be
between those artists and commercial filmmakers, those artists do find
their exact analogy in avant-garde film. As an older woman in a private
club where I once showed an introductory program of avant-garde films
said, "Oh, I get it. These filmmakers are just like the abstract
expressionist painters." Those painters eventually did get a lot of
hype, but when they started painting, there wasn't any, except for a few
manifestoes they wrote themselves.
Fred Camper
15670
From: Noel Vera
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 4:56am
Subject: Re: Philippine cinema
Fred, if I may ask, what Filipino films have you seen? Glad to hear
you've seen some Brocka and Kidlat Tahimik (Quiet Lightning being
the literal translation).
For the record Alexis is one of the younger up-and-coming critics in
the Manila scene. Also member of a rock group called The Brockas (if
I remember right) and (he'll kill me for this) one of the few
straight male models striding the fashion-show ramps in the Makati
Business Area.
15671
From: Noel Vera
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:00am
Subject: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan Takagi"
wrote:
> I must be one of the very few people around who actually
> likes "Mahjong". Everyone tells me the acting (especially
> the British guy) is horrible, but it seems passable to my
> untrained eye.
I suppose one can like it, but would you go so far as to say it's
better than Yi-Yi or Brighter Summer Day?
> even (at the end) touching. I'm not sure how it could be
> compared to Tarantino, do you mean thematically? The boys
> are all novice/amateur crooks.
>
More that amoral crooks with deadpan humor sort of thing. Felt like
Tarantino in slow motion.
15672
From:
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 1:24am
Subject: Re: Re: Yi Yi and the critics (was: Post 1978 Hollywood comedy)
In a message dated 9/16/04 9:10:59 AM, f@f... writes:
> (And by the way, Jonathan's praise of it was not all that
> enormous; see http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/capsules/19688_YI_YI)
>
Yes, but his praise of it IS enormous here:
http://www.chicagoreader.com/movies/archives/2002/0102/020104.html
Kevin John
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15673
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:29am
Subject: Re: Re: Cinema and Hype, re-post
--- Fred Camper wrote:
>
> Kenneth Anger made "Fireworks" at 17. He could
> hardly show it anywhere.
> A rather salacious bio of him, which he refutes,
> suggests that he used
> it to whack off to. I think if you look at
> "Fireworks," that does sound
> plausible. Perhaps that's even part of why he made
> it. This "use'
> doesn't prevent it from also being a great work of
> art, of course.
>
That's a rather ridiculous notion as it's obvious from
the film that he was a VERY advanced 17 year-old,
quite experienced in sexual relations with other men.
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15674
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:37am
Subject: I Heart David O Russell
Just in from "I Heart Huckabees,"and the simplest
thing to say is that it confirms David O. Russell's
standing as one of the most important writer-directors
of his generation.
Quite hard to describe. So much so it's a miracle it
was made at all. There's no obvious "market" for it --
save for philosophy students.
Graduate students in fact.
Jason Schwartzman solidifies his status as the
thinking man's Woody Allen. Dustin Hoffman, Jude Law,
Lily Tomlin, Isabelle Huppert, Naomi Watts and
especially Mark Wahlberg are teriffic in it.
Imagine a Jacques Derrida remake of "Who's Minding the
Store?" and you've pretty much got it.
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15675
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:43am
Subject: re: Yang / Mahjong
Jonathan T, you are not alone! This is the review I did of MAHJONG after
seeing it in Rotterdam in 1997:
"Edward Yang's Mahjong disappointed some devotees of his earlier work, but
for me as a newcomer to Yang - it was an utter delight.
This acidic comedy of sexual and monetary manners runs on some cruel fuel -
particularly in its depiction of the myriad ways in which cocksure men
exploit gullible women - but everything, including initial positions of
class and gender, comes around for reversal and debunking by the end of the
twisted tale.
Yang's style is a beguiling mixture of virtuosic mise en scène, dexterous
mood-switching, intricate multi-character plotting, and an almost clunky
amateurishness, particularly in relation to some of the performances.
But, for me, this unstable brew creates a potent charm - and who can forget
the sight of a sooky young male crying non-stop for about the last quarter
of the film, solely because he finally relented and let a woman kiss him on
the lips?"
Adrian
15676
From:
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 1:42am
Subject: DVD lock ups, possibly OT (WAS: A Brighter Summer Day)
DELETE IF YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT DVD TECHNOLOGY
In a message dated 9/16/04 7:28:46 PM, groups@d... writes:
> Plays fine on my computer, but locks up on my CyberHome 500 DVD player.
>
I recently received a pile of DVD-rs from Spain. Almost all of them play for
about 30-40 minutes and then lock up. I've tried them in three different DVD
players and one computer. Same thing. Does anyone know anything about these
lock ups? Am I out of luck about ever seeing these films?
Kevin John
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15677
From: Fred Camper
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:57am
Subject: Re: Re: Philippine cinema (Lamangan's Wretchec Lives)
Noel Vera wrote:
>Fred, if I may ask, what Filipino films have you seen? ....
>
Not many more than I discussed with Alexis, I fear. I'm not nearly as
omnivores a film viewer as most on this list. I did see a feature or two
that I didn't much like years ago, and whose titles I don't remember,
and a program of super-8 shorts that I remember as at least rather
interesting. And recently I saw "Wretched Lives," which I liked quite a
bit, and which is playing in Chicago tonight and Wednesday night, My
capsule review with links to showtimes is at
http://onfilm.chicagoreader.com/movies/briefs/26513_WRETCHED_LIVES_HUBOG.html
The wild intercutting of personal and political reminded me in a very
distant way of Sam Fuller. Fuller's intercutting or contradictory
perspectives is more profound, almost in an epistemological way. but I
thought "Wretched Lives," or "Hubog," had a tremendous energy, and would
recommend it.
Fred Camper
15678
From: Craig Keller
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 6:08am
Subject: Re: I Heart David O Russell
> Just in from "I Heart Huckabees,"and the simplest
> thing to say is that it confirms David O. Russell's
> standing as one of the most important writer-directors
> of his generation.
Ah! Glad to hear this, David! Based on the trailer, I'm really
looking forward to this picture, and glad to hear it's not a let-down.
I'm willing to bet we won't be able to say the same about Wes
Anderson's 'The Life Aquatic' which, judging by the trailer, looks to
contain an emotional/sentimental arc identical to that of 'The Royal
Tenenbaums,' and continues Wes Anderson's trait of plundering great
songs to soundtrack limp cinematic moments. Specifically, I am
-outraged- that he's using for 'Aquatic' the Devo song, "Gut Feeling /
(Slap Your Mammy)," off of 'Q: Are We Not Men? A: We Are Devo!,'
because I had long planned to make that one of the (likely) two
instances of pop music I'd ever like to incorporate into my films -- it
would have played over the (I guarantee you) virtuoso opening sequence
of a picture I'd like to make about six down the line (from zero), and
it would have left an indelible mark on your, the movie-goer's, life.
Instead, Wes Anderson has beat me to the punch, and now the track's
probably going to play over a mild mood-elevating montage of people
swimming.
At least one thing is for sure: No film in Wes Anderson's
collapsing-black-hole-oeuvre of pastiche is ever going to match the
power of Devo.
craig.
15679
From: Joseph Kaufman
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:46am
Subject: Re: DVD lock ups, possibly OT (WAS: A Brighter Summer Day)
>I recently received a pile of DVD-rs from Spain. Almost all of them play for
>about 30-40 minutes and then lock up. I've tried them in three different DVD
>players and one computer. Same thing. Does anyone know anything about these
>lock ups? Am I out of luck about ever seeing these films?
>
>Kevin John
In my experience these sort of problem discs are unlikely to be
playable anywhere. The DVD-R blanks simply are bad.
Unless...they're actually DVD+R discs and the machines you've been
using are not designed to play the +R format.
--
- Joe Kaufman
15680
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 0:30pm
Subject: Re: I Heart David O Russell
--- Craig Keller wrote:
Wes Anderson's trait of
> plundering great
> songs to soundtrack limp cinematic moments.
WellI thought his use of Nico in "The Royal
Tenenbaums" was exquisite.
> Specifically, I am
> -outraged- that he's using for 'Aquatic' the Devo
> song, "Gut Feeling /
> (Slap Your Mammy)," off of 'Q: Are We Not Men? A: We
> Are Devo!,'
> because I had long planned to make that one of the
> (likely) two
> instances of pop music I'd ever like to incorporate
> into my films -- it
> would have played over the (I guarantee you)
> virtuoso opening sequence
> of a picture I'd like to make about six down the
> line (from zero), and
> it would have left an indelible mark on your, the
> movie-goer's, life.
Well whatchagonna do? Devo's siren call must be
obeyed.
> Instead, Wes Anderson has beat me to the punch, and
> now the track's
> probably going to play over a mild mood-elevating
> montage of people
> swimming.
>
Or not.
> At least one thing is for sure: No film in Wes
> Anderson's
> collapsing-black-hole-oeuvre of pastiche is ever
> going to match the
> power of Devo.
>
You may be right.
One other thing I forgot mention about "Huckabees" --
a delightful featured turn by Tippi Hedren!
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15681
From: cairnsdavid1967
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 0:40pm
Subject: Re: Walken (Was: comic book movies (was: Anderson, Jost, Ozon, Ford, et al)
> I understand from habelove that in his touted performance in the
> NY production of The Dead he made no attempt to assume the
> character or an accent. He played it just like he played the guy in
> the wheelchair in Things To Do In Denver...
The Man With The Plan...
I have a crackpot theory about that one.
(contains spoilers)
I see it as a version of the gospels with Walken as God. "He's just a
head" rants Treat Williams. And the vengeful Old-Testament God is
transformed into a reclusive, kinder God by the death of his son.
The Christ-figure is split between Walken's literal son and Garcia,
whose chaste relationship with a prostitute marks him out as a Jesus-
figure. When he tears up the boardroom, confronting the guy who beat
up Balk's whore character, it's a sort of moneylenders scene.
Like Jesus, he speaks from beyond the grave, (via a videotaped
message)
15682
From: Matt Teichman
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 2:08pm
Subject: Re: DVD lock ups, possibly OT (WAS: A Brighter Summer Day)
You might try ripping one to your hard drive and playing it (if you've
got 4-7 GB of space free)--I've found this usually works with really
stubborn DVDs.
-Matt
>I recently received a pile of DVD-rs from Spain. Almost all of them play for
>about 30-40 minutes and then lock up. I've tried them in three different DVD
>players and one computer. Same thing. Does anyone know anything about these
>lock ups? Am I out of luck about ever seeing these films?
>
>Kevin John
>
>
15683
From: cairnsdavid1967
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 2:09pm
Subject: Batman Returns script (was: comic book movies)
Aiee! I can't read this thing - it ain't in English!
The Father stops and
gapes the cigarette holder out of his mouth to see a
SCREECHING NURSE wail out of the mansion room and
disappear down the other end of the hallway.
A TRAUMATIZED DOCTOR next plows out from the room; hold-
ing his mouth in a frenetic gagging noise.
This is a random selection. I find the first sentence quite ugly, and
the second one doesn't really make sense: he holds his mouth in a
noise?
I agree that it suggests something which in fact works well on
screen, but I wish more screenwriters could actually write.
15684
From: Travis Miles
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:13pm
Subject: Re: Re: Philippine cinema
Anyone know of a source for English subtitled Brockas (esp. Manila-In the
Claws of Neon)?
On 9/17/04 12:56 AM, "Noel Vera" wrote:
> Fred, if I may ask, what Filipino films have you seen? Glad to hear
> you've seen some Brocka and Kidlat Tahimik (Quiet Lightning being
> the literal translation).
>
> For the record Alexis is one of the younger up-and-coming critics in
> the Manila scene. Also member of a rock group called The Brockas (if
> I remember right) and (he'll kill me for this) one of the few
> straight male models striding the fashion-show ramps in the Makati
> Business Area.
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
15685
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:21pm
Subject: Re: Walken (Was: comic book movies (was: Anderson, Jost, Ozon, Ford, et al)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "cairnsdavid1967"
wrote:
>
> The Man With The Plan...
>
> I have a crackpot theory about that one.
>
> (contains spoilers)
>
> I see it as a version of the gospels with Walken as God.
Sounds good to me -- the "cold dead penis" certainly fits.
15686
From: thebradstevens
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:22pm
Subject: David Thomson 'answers' his critics!
Given the amount of hostile criticism to which recent editions of
David Thomson's BIOGRAPHICAL DICTIONARY OF FILM have been subjected,
I was wondering how long it would take Thomson to start answering his
detractors. His piece on Jacques Rivette in the new SIGHT AND SOUND
contains what I guess must be his response to all those commentators
who pointed out Thomson's inability to deal with the most important
contemporary filmmakers:
"The hope for the movies is not that they make a new art -
futuristic, adolescent, fascistic (if I may say so). It's more that
they find a way of linking up with all our other forms of story-
telling, while appealing to people who do have other tastes or sides
to their lives - spouses, children, sports, waether, leg-pulling, I
could go on and on and will if it upsets those cretins who prefer to
spend every minute in the dark."
Thomson, we should recall, was once a serious critic who became
disillusioned with cinema, and unexpectedly discovered that writing
about this disillusionment was far more financially profitable than
celebrating the work of Angelopoulos and Ophuls. 'There are beter
things to do than watching films' is essentially the subject of
everything Thomson has written in the last two decades. And who can
blame him? He's obviously connected with a large audience which wants
to be reassured that it's really okay to be bored with Eisenstein,
Bresson, Welles, Kiarostami, Hou, etc. That it's just fine if you
can't be bothered to make any kind of effort to comprehend directors
whose ambitions extend beyond providing entertainment for children
(of all ages).
What I cannot understand is why the world of film criticism so
consistently attracts third-rate thinkers such as Thomson (who
provides nothing more than a slightly intellectualised variation on
the kind of writing which dominates VARIETY and PREMIERE). Would a
serious literary critic asked to write about, say, Faulkner dare turn
in a text encouraging readers to put away those dusty books and take
a bracing walk? Would an art critic reevaluating Picasso even
consider upbraiding her readers for spending their leisure hours in
an art gallery when they could be out feeding bunny wabbits? Would a
specialist in classical music think it worthwhile to suggest that
listening to a new recording of a Beethoven symphony might be a less
profitable activity than playing football?
Brad 'cretin' Stevens.
15687
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:23pm
Subject: Re: Batman Returns script (was: comic book movies)
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "cairnsdavid1967"
wrote:
> The Father stops and
> gapes the cigarette holder out of his mouth to see a
> SCREECHING NURSE wail out of the mansion room and
> disappear down the other end of the hallway.
Ah, Chester Copperpot! Burton was washing dishes for a living
when Paul Rubens called and asked him to helm Pee Wee's Big
Adventure, and he never forgot. Batman Returns was just after
Rubens' misadventure in Florida.
15688
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:29pm
Subject: Re: David Thomson 'answers' his critics!
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "thebradstevens" <
>
> What I cannot understand is why the world of film criticism so
> consistently attracts third-rate thinkers such as Thomson (who
> provides nothing more than a slightly intellectualised variation
on
> the kind of writing which dominates VARIETY and PREMIERE).
Would a
> serious literary critic asked to write about, say, Faulkner dare
turn
> in a text encouraging readers to put away those dusty books
and take
> a bracing walk? Would an art critic reevaluating Picasso even
> consider upbraiding her readers for spending their leisure
hours in
> an art gallery when they could be out feeding bunny wabbits?
Would a
> specialist in classical music think it worthwhile to suggest that
> listening to a new recording of a Beethoven symphony might
be a less
> profitable activity than playing football?
Of course not, but sadly, even Thomson probably writes better
than most of the Tenture Tots who would get those
assignments. And I am no fan of Thomson.
In a very early thread I quoted Adrian to the effect that Thomson
has captured the mantle of Kael -- the average middle class
culturatum's answer to all those dreadful people writing about
"filum." That insight totally nails Thomson. What I raised by
quoting Adrian was the question: Why are Kaels and Thomsons
needed? Is the auteur theory really THAT much of a threat?
15689
From: Craig Keller
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:44pm
Subject: Re: David Thomson 'answers' his critics!
> Would a
> serious literary critic asked to write about, say, Faulkner dare turn
> in a text encouraging readers to put away those dusty books and take
> a bracing walk? Would an art critic reevaluating Picasso even
> consider upbraiding her readers for spending their leisure hours in
> an art gallery when they could be out feeding bunny wabbits? Would a
> specialist in classical music think it worthwhile to suggest that
> listening to a new recording of a Beethoven symphony might be a less
> profitable activity than playing football?
Great riposte, Brad. Thomson obviously had something traumatic happen
to him at some point -- missed a date with the love of his life? -- and
a running-time was to blame. Now because he has an also-ran spouse and
has to attend after-school soccer games he's projecting his bile... at
the screen.
What was the gist of his Rivette article?
(PS to all interested - 'Histoire de Marie et Julien' is coming out on
DVD in the UK, with English subs, courtesy of Artificial Eye.)
craig.
15690
From: Alexis Tioseco
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:47pm
Subject: Re: Re: Philippine cinema
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, "Noel Vera"
wrote:
> For the record Alexis is one of the younger
up-and-coming >critics in the Manila scene. Also
member of a rock group >called The Brockas (if I
remember right) and (he'll kill me for >this) one of
the few straight male models striding the
>fashion-show ramps in the Makati Business Area.>
For the record, I was to be the drummer of the band
The Brockas, but alas, I accepted the job without
having picked up sticks, and was too slowly in
learning (had two "lessons' while the rest of the band
was fastly approaching recording level in playing) and
sadly was replaced. As of present and I exist as the
bands official fictional biographer.
The Brockas, btw, are named after the late Filipino
director, the (a number of times but not always) great
Lino Brocka.
In regard to the modelling... as much as I hate admit
it, Noel caught me at an inopportune time and is
speaking the truth. If it weren't for my unbridled
honesty I would lie and vehemently deny it. Somehow I
feel much less credible now to you all... for the
record, the instance Noel is referring to is the first
and last time that I did that.
Moving on to film things...
I'm flattered to hear Noel call me one of the up and
coming critics in the Manila scene. Truth be told,
and many from the Philippines will attest to this,
Noel is likely the only critic in/from the Philippines
at present worth his salt, with a strong understanding
of film, knowledge (and thirst for knowledge) of
Philippine Cinema and Global Cinema History, and the
with the balls to the tell the truth about what he
sees... to the extent that he has met the unfriendly
glare of quite a number of commercially prominent
figures in Philippine Cinema over the years.
Thanks for the introduction Fred, and for accepting me
to the list.
As always when encountering foreign cinephiles, I feel
compelled to pop the question:
What is your impression of Philippine Cinema (both new
and old)?
What Filipino films have you seen? What Filipino
filmmakers names appear in your head like light bulbs
in cartoons when you think of the Philippines?
Looking forward to hearing from everyone on a_film_by
on the matter.
15691
From: Fred Camper
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:51pm
Subject: Re: David Thomson 'answers' his critics!
Brad Sevens, quoting David Thomson:
> ...I could go on and on and will if it upsets those cretins who prefer to
>spend every minute in the dark."...
>
When El Greco, as a young painter, lived in Venice, he had a good friend in the great manuscript illuminator Guilio Clovio. One spring day Clovio. noticing the wonderful sunny weather and how everyone was out and about, felt exultant, and went over the great painter's apartment to ask if he didn't want to take a walk with him in the fine spring sun. He found El Greco with his windows blocking out the light, sitting in a darkened room neither sleeping nor working. Clovio said to El Greco, "Wouldn't you like to come for a walk with me on this wonderful sunny day," and El Greco replied, "The sunlight blinds me to the light I have within me."
The decades of sublime "inner light" paintings El Greco made following this incident give it its real meaning.
Fred Camper (quoting from memory of a book I read it in years ago, which presumably was itself not wholly accurate)
15692
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:29pm
Subject: Academic Job Opening
UC Davis needs to replace a guy who's retiring -- an eclectic
post covering everything from film to video to art to production, as
I understand it. There's no film dept per se, but interested parties
should e-mail Gina Werfel, chair of art and art history, at
gswerfl@u.... It hasn't been posted yet, but will be
shortly.
15693
From: David Ehrenstein
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 8:20pm
Subject: Re: Academic Job Opening
Are you sure you have the right e-mail address? That
one doesn't work.
--- hotlove666 wrote:
> UC Davis needs to replace a guy who's retiring -- an
> eclectic
> post covering everything from film to video to art
> to production, as
> I understand it. There's no film dept per se, but
> interested parties
> should e-mail Gina Werfel, chair of art and art
> history, at
> gswerfl@u.... It hasn't been posted yet, but
> will be
> shortly.
>
>
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15694
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 8:35pm
Subject: Academic Job Opening ERRATUM - corrected e-mail
David --
Thanks for correcting that. Here's the same post with the
corrected address:
> UC Davis needs to replace a guy who's retiring -- an eclectic
> post covering everything from film to video to art to production,
as
> I understand it. There's no film dept per se, but interested
parties
> should e-mail Gina Werfel, chair of art and art history, at
> gswerfel@u.... It hasn't been posted yet, but will be
> shortly.
15695
From: hotlove666
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 8:57pm
Subject: Academic Job Opening ERRATUM - corrected e-mail
David --
Thanks for correcting that. Here's the same post with the
corrected address:
> UC Davis needs to replace a guy who's retiring -- an eclectic
> post covering everything from film to video to art to production,
as
> I understand it. There's no film dept per se, but interested
parties
> should e-mail Gina Werfel, chair of art and art history, at
> gswerfel@u.... It hasn't been posted yet, but will be
> shortly.
15696
From: Adrian Martin
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 10:48pm
Subject: Re: Thomson
Craig wrote:
"Thomson obviously had something traumatic happen
to him at some point -- missed a date with the love of his life? -- and
a running-time was to blame."
Some people claim
There was a running-time to blame
But I think it's his own damn fault
- from "Wasting Away Again in Alphaville"
15697
From: peckinpah20012000
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 11:11pm
Subject: Re: Thomson
--- In a_film_by@yahoogroups.com, Adrian Martin
wrote:
>
> Craig wrote:
> "Thomson obviously had something traumatic happen
> to him at some point -- missed a date with the love of his life? --
and
> a running-time was to blame."
>
> Thomson has sold his talents to the vulgar cultural perspective
of Tony Blair's "New Labour" which regards any form of challenging
art as "elitist" and follows the axiom of Blair's groupie Peter
Mandelson who defines "a walk in the park" as representing culture.
He also defended the expensive, artistic disaster of the Millenium
Dome as "knocking one's socks off."
Since the 1990s a generation of new establishment critics such as
Jonathan Ross have appeared whose ignorant, assertive work has often
appeared in Rupert Murodoch tabloid publications such as THE TIMES
whose discourse is more aimed at "man in the street" vulgar opinion
than representing the best type of critical perspective. Thomson
has merely changed his course since he sees that the money lies in
newspaper journalism, correctly associated with Pauline Kael in an
earlier post, who cater to the lowest common denominator. B. Ruby
Rich is another example as her polemic against Orson Welles last
year shows.
Recently, a newspaper report in England pointed out that the British
Federation of Film Societies was facing curtailment of funding due
to its lack of "diversity" in terms of showing films by Eisenstein,
Welles, Renoir etc - all of whom were now regarded as "politically
incorrect" in Blair's "septic isle."
Thomson is just another example of this
dispiriting phenomenom as his article last weekend criticizing
Lauren Bacall revealed. He took issue with the fact that Bacall,
during the Venice Film Festival,criticized the term of "legend"
being applied to Nicole Kidman.
Rather than recognizing that Bacall queried the use of a term which
usually involved the longevity of a quality career, Thomson
immediately engaged in a diatribe against Bacall's film career.
I believe another female "guru" (whose name escapes me at the
moment, [perhaps, mercifully, due to repression] which Brad Stevens
will supply) wrote a meandering article in Murdoch's SUNDAY TIMES
several years ago, criticizing Lauren Bacall and extolling the
virtues of Cynthia Rothrock.
Thomson belongs to this cultural devastation affecting criticism in
England associated with Rupert Murdoch whom the late Dennis Potter
aptly compared to the "cancer" that would eventually kill him.
Tony Williams
15698
From:
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:22pm
Subject: Re: Re: Philippine cinema
<>
Actually, that makes you more credible (to me, at least). Welcome!
Re: Philippine cinema, I'm damn near 100% brain dead about it but I'm on it.
Bordwell/Thompson's Film History mentions that musicals (zarzuela) were
popular in the mid-1970s. Can you tell us about those? How do they differ from
Hollywood musicals? Are any remotely easy to find on DVD/VHS?
Kevin John
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15699
From:
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 7:28pm
Subject: Film title standards?
I checked the site for any standards on how to write film titles but couldn't
find anything. Normally, I would italicize but I don't think italics travel
well (at all?) across the internet. So is it quotes or caps? Or?
Kevin John
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15700
From: Fred Camper
Date: Fri Sep 17, 2004 11:53pm
Subject: Re: Film title standards?
I always urge unformatted email on everyone. html email allows italics
but not everyone can read it, and I think one great thing about email is
that it's just text, one has to express oneself that way, and I hate it
when people send me "emails" with flashing pictures and all that. Plus
group members can turn html formatting off so they may not be able to
receive that anyway.
We've never made rules about formatting titles here. Most people seem to
prefer all caps. I personally prefer quotes and use them instead. It
seems to me that either is fine. The important thing is to spell the
whole title out. Remember that not everyone will know that TMWSLV is
"The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence," especially if you're mentioning it
in a thread whose subject line is "Mistranslation from the Arabic in the
French subtitles of two recent Algerian Films."
Fred Camper
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